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U.S. Military Should Get out of the Middle East; America is no different from other imperial powers, ensnared repeatedly in costly, bloody, and eventually futile overseas war
Topic Started: Apr 9 2017, 05:44 PM (968 Views)
Robertr2000
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voted4reagan
Apr 10 2017, 12:29 PM
Harambe4Trump
Apr 9 2017, 11:47 PM
Attaburnsinhell
Apr 9 2017, 11:44 PM
The Inquisitor
Apr 9 2017, 11:30 PM
Attaburnsinhell
Apr 9 2017, 10:50 PM

Quoting limited to 5 levels deep
If I had the answer, I'd be an instant Zillionare.
Unfortunately the lessons of regime change in WW2 weren't observed.
When bush 1 went into Iraq the first time, with help of the coalition it should have been occupied and governed like Berlin, less the wall.
Now, we are just too involved in the ME to not be involved and all our exit strategies haven't worked.


WWII wasnt regime change, there are practically no parallels to that. Germany was totally defeated and cooperated with the West and the Soviets.

The ME is made up of hostile religions and tribes that have no intention of cooperating with whoever gets stuck with the job of occupation.

Assad's sect, the Aliwaits, are shiite and hated by all the other tribes in Syria. Assad's fall would result in a bloodbath of his tribe, which is why theyre acting so viciously
WWII and WWI were every bit the false flags that Vietnam, Iraq, and Syria were.
You're insane
You're ignorant.
"if that **** wins we'll all hang from nooses"
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voted4reagan
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jake58
Apr 9 2017, 10:59 PM
Attaburnsinhell
Apr 9 2017, 10:50 PM
voted4reagan
Apr 9 2017, 07:49 PM
Should we allow ASSAD to Gas his own people?
What would you suggest we do?

Assad drops gas, we'll end up dropping WP, napalm on more civilians. In fact, we've killed hundreds just this week in Iraq and Yeman

Once we go in there, we're there for years and years of occupation in a hostile environment, stuck among dozens of factions

By year two everyone will be saying what the hell are we doing there?
If you want to take action you go after Assad personally and take him out, perhaps the guy with the Prince Valiant haircut on the Korean peninsula takes notice. There's zero miltary gain from this latest action other than some live target shooting for the Navy. Politically it has some benefit but I'd rather we not waste 60 Tomahawks on a few points temporary boost in Trump's approval rating.
Assad kills civilians with Sarin Gas.. Cost Very little...

United states wipes out Syrian Airbase reducing it's functional ability to support Aircraft to ZERO. 20 Attack Aircraft, Support Aircraft, Air Defense Capability, Fuel and Ammunition Depots, Barracks, Runways, Aircraft Shelters and all infrastructure...

Costs - Hundreds of Millions of Dollars.

Cost in Cruise Missiles - 150 to 200 Million

No American Lives Lost

If Assad wants to trade 100 Civilians for Each Airbase he'll be defenseless in Short order...

He was sent a message that to VIOLATE INTERNATIONAL LAW on the use of GAS WEAPONS against anyone will result in swift retaliation and a reduction in his ability to wage war...

He intentionally violated United Nations Security council resolution 2118 adopted on September 27th, 2013, It recalled United Nations Security Council Resolutions 1540, 2042 and 2043

resolution 1540 was adopted unanimously on 28 April 2004 regarding the non-proliferation of weapons of mass destruction.

resolution 2042 authorizes the dispatch of an advance team of up to 30 unarmed military observers to Syria to monitor compliance with the ceasefire agreement. The observers will be tasked with establishing and maintaining contact with both sides of the conflict, and making reports on compliance with the ceasefire agreement until a full mission is deployed in the country.

Resolution 2043 Condemning the widespread violations of human rights by the Syrian
authorities, as well as any human rights abuses by armed groups, recalling that those
responsible shall be held accountable, and expressing its profound regret at the
death of many thousands of people in Syria, .... (This pertains to USE OF CHEMICAL WEAPONS by the assad Government in prior attacks)

So ATTA....How many UN Security council Resolutions are you willing to overlook? I can find more that have been violated....

Lets Start with UNSCR 2209 - The United Nations Security Council Resolution 2209 condemns any use of chemicals as a weapon in the Syrian Civil War and threatens to use force if chemical weapons are used again in the conflict.

We upheld the UN Resolution for the United Nations...

Should we NOT uphold the United Nations Resolution??

Or should we turn a Blind eye?

No... we did the right thing... I(f you argue against it you support Assad and his use of Chemical Weapons as addressed in UNSCR 2209

Checkmate to those arguing against the attack made by the United States against Syria...

You may now shut up...

Trump needs to focus more so on the male vote. He should have nationalized the Boy Scouts when they decided to admit girls.

Harambe4Trump AKA "FASHY"
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BuckFan

Attaburnsinhell
Apr 9 2017, 10:50 PM
voted4reagan
Apr 9 2017, 07:49 PM
Should we allow ASSAD to Gas his own people?
What would you suggest we do?

Assad drops gas, we'll end up dropping WP, napalm on more civilians. In fact, we've killed hundreds just this week in Iraq and Yeman

Once we go in there, we're there for years and years of occupation in a hostile environment, stuck among dozens of factions

By year two everyone will be saying what the hell are we doing there?
We have? Do you have a link to those attacks in Iraq and yemen? I ask because I do not remember any coverage of attacks in Yemen this past week.
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BuckFan

Robertr2000
Apr 10 2017, 11:26 AM
Demagogue
Apr 10 2017, 11:10 AM
Here is a fun thought, Assad uses a chemical munition to kill less than 100 people and we are outraged so much at the action that we launch 60 missiles to destroy the base and make threats of more involvement.

Now, compare that to some of the African nations where rival tribes will literally hack to pieces tens of thousands and what is our reaction? Nothing.

What is worse? A nerve agent that kills in minutes (sometimes even quicker) or ritual rape and dismemberment?

Just a thought for those who wish us to be world police. Where does it stop?
"Assad uses a chemical munition to kill less than 100 people "


Proof? Evidence? Anything?
The US tracked the planes that were used in the attack.
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CautionaryTales
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Harambe4Trump
Apr 9 2017, 08:42 PM
voted4reagan
Apr 9 2017, 07:49 PM
Should we allow ASSAD to Gas his own people?
Not our problem.
We helped to create the problems the ME present the world.
It's a global problem and this country has been a global country since at least WWII.


Before that we were formed as a global country.... so...there it is...
Edited by CautionaryTales, Apr 10 2017, 01:20 PM.


Have you paid your internet taxes?
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Demagogue
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BuckFan
Apr 10 2017, 01:10 PM
Robertr2000
Apr 10 2017, 11:26 AM
Demagogue
Apr 10 2017, 11:10 AM
Here is a fun thought, Assad uses a chemical munition to kill less than 100 people and we are outraged so much at the action that we launch 60 missiles to destroy the base and make threats of more involvement.

Now, compare that to some of the African nations where rival tribes will literally hack to pieces tens of thousands and what is our reaction? Nothing.

What is worse? A nerve agent that kills in minutes (sometimes even quicker) or ritual rape and dismemberment?

Just a thought for those who wish us to be world police. Where does it stop?
"Assad uses a chemical munition to kill less than 100 people "


Proof? Evidence? Anything?
The US tracked the planes that were used in the attack.
In addition to that most chemical weapons folks agree that a stockpile that was bombed while in storage on the ground would not have dispersed like these did.

Basically those two items are the entirety of the evidence against Assad as I understand it.
People sleep peacefully in their beds at night only because rough men stand ready to visit violence on those who would do them harm.
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BuckFan

Demagogue
Apr 10 2017, 01:23 PM
BuckFan
Apr 10 2017, 01:10 PM
Robertr2000
Apr 10 2017, 11:26 AM
Demagogue
Apr 10 2017, 11:10 AM
Here is a fun thought, Assad uses a chemical munition to kill less than 100 people and we are outraged so much at the action that we launch 60 missiles to destroy the base and make threats of more involvement.

Now, compare that to some of the African nations where rival tribes will literally hack to pieces tens of thousands and what is our reaction? Nothing.

What is worse? A nerve agent that kills in minutes (sometimes even quicker) or ritual rape and dismemberment?

Just a thought for those who wish us to be world police. Where does it stop?
"Assad uses a chemical munition to kill less than 100 people "


Proof? Evidence? Anything?
The US tracked the planes that were used in the attack.
In addition to that most chemical weapons folks agree that a stockpile that was bombed while in storage on the ground would not have dispersed like these did.

Basically those two items are the entirety of the evidence against Assad as I understand it.
There was also a report that the bomb hit in the middle of the street not a building or other place where rebel weapons would have been held.
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Demagogue
Member Avatar
Administrator
BuckFan
Apr 10 2017, 01:53 PM
Demagogue
Apr 10 2017, 01:23 PM
BuckFan
Apr 10 2017, 01:10 PM
Robertr2000
Apr 10 2017, 11:26 AM
Demagogue
Apr 10 2017, 11:10 AM
Here is a fun thought, Assad uses a chemical munition to kill less than 100 people and we are outraged so much at the action that we launch 60 missiles to destroy the base and make threats of more involvement.

Now, compare that to some of the African nations where rival tribes will literally hack to pieces tens of thousands and what is our reaction? Nothing.

What is worse? A nerve agent that kills in minutes (sometimes even quicker) or ritual rape and dismemberment?

Just a thought for those who wish us to be world police. Where does it stop?
"Assad uses a chemical munition to kill less than 100 people "


Proof? Evidence? Anything?
The US tracked the planes that were used in the attack.
In addition to that most chemical weapons folks agree that a stockpile that was bombed while in storage on the ground would not have dispersed like these did.

Basically those two items are the entirety of the evidence against Assad as I understand it.
There was also a report that the bomb hit in the middle of the street not a building or other place where rebel weapons would have been held.
Most of the time you drop more than one bomb. Also there are reports of them targeting a single story building. Those same eyewitness reports say that the bomb released a yellow mushroom cloud. That cloud would make sense if the weapon was mustard gas, with this being Sarin gas though I am not so certain that the yellow can be counted on as an indicator of a chemical weapon. Sarin is supposed to be colorless and odorless.
People sleep peacefully in their beds at night only because rough men stand ready to visit violence on those who would do them harm.
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Robertr2000
Member Avatar

BuckFan
Apr 10 2017, 01:10 PM
Robertr2000
Apr 10 2017, 11:26 AM
Demagogue
Apr 10 2017, 11:10 AM
Here is a fun thought, Assad uses a chemical munition to kill less than 100 people and we are outraged so much at the action that we launch 60 missiles to destroy the base and make threats of more involvement.

Now, compare that to some of the African nations where rival tribes will literally hack to pieces tens of thousands and what is our reaction? Nothing.

What is worse? A nerve agent that kills in minutes (sometimes even quicker) or ritual rape and dismemberment?

Just a thought for those who wish us to be world police. Where does it stop?
"Assad uses a chemical munition to kill less than 100 people "


Proof? Evidence? Anything?
The US tracked the planes that were used in the attack.
provide proof.
"if that **** wins we'll all hang from nooses"
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BuckFan

Robertr2000
Apr 10 2017, 02:37 PM
BuckFan
Apr 10 2017, 01:10 PM
Robertr2000
Apr 10 2017, 11:26 AM
Demagogue
Apr 10 2017, 11:10 AM
Here is a fun thought, Assad uses a chemical munition to kill less than 100 people and we are outraged so much at the action that we launch 60 missiles to destroy the base and make threats of more involvement.

Now, compare that to some of the African nations where rival tribes will literally hack to pieces tens of thousands and what is our reaction? Nothing.

What is worse? A nerve agent that kills in minutes (sometimes even quicker) or ritual rape and dismemberment?

Just a thought for those who wish us to be world police. Where does it stop?
"Assad uses a chemical munition to kill less than 100 people "


Proof? Evidence? Anything?
The US tracked the planes that were used in the attack.
provide proof.
Sorry, I have to go on the word of the U.S. military on this one. I do not possess the technology to track aircraft in Syria though it would be cool to have such toys.
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Robertr2000
Member Avatar

BuckFan
Apr 10 2017, 02:48 PM
Robertr2000
Apr 10 2017, 02:37 PM
BuckFan
Apr 10 2017, 01:10 PM
Robertr2000
Apr 10 2017, 11:26 AM
Demagogue
Apr 10 2017, 11:10 AM
Here is a fun thought, Assad uses a chemical munition to kill less than 100 people and we are outraged so much at the action that we launch 60 missiles to destroy the base and make threats of more involvement.

Now, compare that to some of the African nations where rival tribes will literally hack to pieces tens of thousands and what is our reaction? Nothing.

What is worse? A nerve agent that kills in minutes (sometimes even quicker) or ritual rape and dismemberment?

Just a thought for those who wish us to be world police. Where does it stop?
"Assad uses a chemical munition to kill less than 100 people "


Proof? Evidence? Anything?
The US tracked the planes that were used in the attack.
provide proof.
Sorry, I have to go on the word of the U.S. military on this one. I do not possess the technology to track aircraft in Syria though it would be cool to have such toys.
Right.
"if that **** wins we'll all hang from nooses"
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voted4reagan
Member Avatar

BuckFan
Apr 10 2017, 02:48 PM
Robertr2000
Apr 10 2017, 02:37 PM
BuckFan
Apr 10 2017, 01:10 PM
Robertr2000
Apr 10 2017, 11:26 AM
Demagogue
Apr 10 2017, 11:10 AM
Here is a fun thought, Assad uses a chemical munition to kill less than 100 people and we are outraged so much at the action that we launch 60 missiles to destroy the base and make threats of more involvement.

Now, compare that to some of the African nations where rival tribes will literally hack to pieces tens of thousands and what is our reaction? Nothing.

What is worse? A nerve agent that kills in minutes (sometimes even quicker) or ritual rape and dismemberment?

Just a thought for those who wish us to be world police. Where does it stop?
"Assad uses a chemical munition to kill less than 100 people "


Proof? Evidence? Anything?
The US tracked the planes that were used in the attack.
provide proof.
Sorry, I have to go on the word of the U.S. military on this one. I do not possess the technology to track aircraft in Syria though it would be cool to have such toys.
No Commercial Air Traffic over Lebanon, Iraq
or Syria as we speak
Attached to this post:
Attachments: FireShot_Screen_Capture__300____Live_Flight_Tracker_____FlightAware____flightaware_com_live.png (194.13 KB)
Edited by voted4reagan, Apr 10 2017, 05:47 PM.
Trump needs to focus more so on the male vote. He should have nationalized the Boy Scouts when they decided to admit girls.

Harambe4Trump AKA "FASHY"
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Robertr2000
Member Avatar

BuckFan
Apr 10 2017, 02:48 PM
Robertr2000
Apr 10 2017, 02:37 PM
BuckFan
Apr 10 2017, 01:10 PM
Robertr2000
Apr 10 2017, 11:26 AM
Demagogue
Apr 10 2017, 11:10 AM
Here is a fun thought, Assad uses a chemical munition to kill less than 100 people and we are outraged so much at the action that we launch 60 missiles to destroy the base and make threats of more involvement.

Now, compare that to some of the African nations where rival tribes will literally hack to pieces tens of thousands and what is our reaction? Nothing.

What is worse? A nerve agent that kills in minutes (sometimes even quicker) or ritual rape and dismemberment?

Just a thought for those who wish us to be world police. Where does it stop?
"Assad uses a chemical munition to kill less than 100 people "


Proof? Evidence? Anything?
The US tracked the planes that were used in the attack.
provide proof.
Sorry, I have to go on the word of the U.S. military on this one. I do not possess the technology to track aircraft in Syria though it would be cool to have such toys.
Posted Image
Posted Image

:box:
"if that **** wins we'll all hang from nooses"
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Robert Stout
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voted4reagan
Apr 10 2017, 12:57 PM
jake58
Apr 9 2017, 10:59 PM
Attaburnsinhell
Apr 9 2017, 10:50 PM
voted4reagan
Apr 9 2017, 07:49 PM
Should we allow ASSAD to Gas his own people?
What would you suggest we do?

Assad drops gas, we'll end up dropping WP, napalm on more civilians. In fact, we've killed hundreds just this week in Iraq and Yeman

Once we go in there, we're there for years and years of occupation in a hostile environment, stuck among dozens of factions

By year two everyone will be saying what the hell are we doing there?
If you want to take action you go after Assad personally and take him out, perhaps the guy with the Prince Valiant haircut on the Korean peninsula takes notice. There's zero miltary gain from this latest action other than some live target shooting for the Navy. Politically it has some benefit but I'd rather we not waste 60 Tomahawks on a few points temporary boost in Trump's approval rating.
Assad kills civilians with Sarin Gas.. Cost Very little...

United states wipes out Syrian Airbase reducing it's functional ability to support Aircraft to ZERO. 20 Attack Aircraft, Support Aircraft, Air Defense Capability, Fuel and Ammunition Depots, Barracks, Runways, Aircraft Shelters and all infrastructure...

Costs - Hundreds of Millions of Dollars.

Cost in Cruise Missiles - 150 to 200 Million

No American Lives Lost

If Assad wants to trade 100 Civilians for Each Airbase he'll be defenseless in Short order...

He was sent a message that to VIOLATE INTERNATIONAL LAW on the use of GAS WEAPONS against anyone will result in swift retaliation and a reduction in his ability to wage war...

He intentionally violated United Nations Security council resolution 2118 adopted on September 27th, 2013, It recalled United Nations Security Council Resolutions 1540, 2042 and 2043

resolution 1540 was adopted unanimously on 28 April 2004 regarding the non-proliferation of weapons of mass destruction.

resolution 2042 authorizes the dispatch of an advance team of up to 30 unarmed military observers to Syria to monitor compliance with the ceasefire agreement. The observers will be tasked with establishing and maintaining contact with both sides of the conflict, and making reports on compliance with the ceasefire agreement until a full mission is deployed in the country.

Resolution 2043 Condemning the widespread violations of human rights by the Syrian
authorities, as well as any human rights abuses by armed groups, recalling that those
responsible shall be held accountable, and expressing its profound regret at the
death of many thousands of people in Syria, .... (This pertains to USE OF CHEMICAL WEAPONS by the assad Government in prior attacks)

So ATTA....How many UN Security council Resolutions are you willing to overlook? I can find more that have been violated....

Lets Start with UNSCR 2209 - The United Nations Security Council Resolution 2209 condemns any use of chemicals as a weapon in the Syrian Civil War and threatens to use force if chemical weapons are used again in the conflict.

We upheld the UN Resolution for the United Nations...

Should we NOT uphold the United Nations Resolution??

Or should we turn a Blind eye?

No... we did the right thing... I(f you argue against it you support Assad and his use of Chemical Weapons as addressed in UNSCR 2209

Checkmate to those arguing against the attack made by the United States against Syria...

You may now shut up...

When is the UN going to reimburse us for 60 cruise missiles to impose their UNSCR 2209 ?????........ :rollseyes:
Jesus can raise the dead, but he can't fix stupid
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Harambe4Trump
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voted4reagan
Apr 10 2017, 12:22 PM
Harambe4Trump
Apr 9 2017, 08:42 PM
voted4reagan
Apr 9 2017, 07:49 PM
Should we allow ASSAD to Gas his own people?
Not our problem.
Maybe he'll sell some of that Iraqi Sarin Gas to a Terrorist that will deploy it against someone you know.. Still someone elses problem???

Iraqis should be banned from entering the country.
Skipping leg day is the equivalent of a woman having an abortion. You're ashamed of it, and it was probably unnecessary.
#MAGA
#wallsnotwars
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Harambe4Trump
Member Avatar

CautionaryTales
Apr 10 2017, 01:14 PM
Harambe4Trump
Apr 9 2017, 08:42 PM
voted4reagan
Apr 9 2017, 07:49 PM
Should we allow ASSAD to Gas his own people?
Not our problem.
We helped to create the problems the ME present the world.
It's a global problem and this country has been a global country since at least WWII.


Before that we were formed as a global country.... so...there it is...
It's time to return our isolationist roots.
Skipping leg day is the equivalent of a woman having an abortion. You're ashamed of it, and it was probably unnecessary.
#MAGA
#wallsnotwars
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voted4reagan
Member Avatar

Harambe4Trump
Apr 10 2017, 06:46 PM
CautionaryTales
Apr 10 2017, 01:14 PM
Harambe4Trump
Apr 9 2017, 08:42 PM
voted4reagan
Apr 9 2017, 07:49 PM
Should we allow ASSAD to Gas his own people?
Not our problem.
We helped to create the problems the ME present the world.
It's a global problem and this country has been a global country since at least WWII.


Before that we were formed as a global country.... so...there it is...
It's time to return our isolationist roots.
That led to WWI and WWII...

You still haven't learned from history have you?

You want to keep making the same mistakes it seems...

Trump needs to focus more so on the male vote. He should have nationalized the Boy Scouts when they decided to admit girls.

Harambe4Trump AKA "FASHY"
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lucash
Member Avatar
#NeverTrump
voted4reagan
Apr 12 2017, 12:46 AM
Harambe4Trump
Apr 10 2017, 06:46 PM
CautionaryTales
Apr 10 2017, 01:14 PM
Harambe4Trump
Apr 9 2017, 08:42 PM
voted4reagan
Apr 9 2017, 07:49 PM
Should we allow ASSAD to Gas his own people?
Not our problem.
We helped to create the problems the ME present the world.
It's a global problem and this country has been a global country since at least WWII.


Before that we were formed as a global country.... so...there it is...
It's time to return our isolationist roots.
That led to WWI and WWII...

You still haven't learned from history have you?

You want to keep making the same mistakes it seems...

I'm probably having a memory lapse but, in your opinion, how exactly did the isolationism of the US lead to WW1 and WW2? I've an idea what you might argue but I'd rather get it straight from you.

Cheers.
"...a mesmerized state that makes us accept as inevitable that which is detrimental...having lost the will..to demand...good..." - Rachel Carson
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Robertr2000
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voted4reagan
Apr 12 2017, 12:46 AM
Harambe4Trump
Apr 10 2017, 06:46 PM
CautionaryTales
Apr 10 2017, 01:14 PM
Harambe4Trump
Apr 9 2017, 08:42 PM
voted4reagan
Apr 9 2017, 07:49 PM
Should we allow ASSAD to Gas his own people?
Not our problem.
We helped to create the problems the ME present the world.
It's a global problem and this country has been a global country since at least WWII.


Before that we were formed as a global country.... so...there it is...
It's time to return our isolationist roots.
That led to WWI and WWII...

You still haven't learned from history have you?

You want to keep making the same mistakes it seems...

The old ways will die out.


Hold are you?
"if that **** wins we'll all hang from nooses"
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Robertr2000
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Robertr2000
Apr 10 2017, 05:51 PM
BuckFan
Apr 10 2017, 02:48 PM
Robertr2000
Apr 10 2017, 02:37 PM
BuckFan
Apr 10 2017, 01:10 PM
Robertr2000
Apr 10 2017, 11:26 AM

Quoting limited to 5 levels deep"Assad uses a chemical munition to kill less than 100 people "<br /><br /><br />Proof? Evidence? Anything?
The US tracked the planes that were used in the attack.
provide proof.
Sorry, I have to go on the word of the U.S. military on this one. I do not possess the technology to track aircraft in Syria though it would be cool to have such toys.
Posted Image<br />Posted Image<br /><br /> :box: <br />
"if that **** wins we'll all hang from nooses"
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