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Russia’s GDP growth accelerates in 2Q as recovery takes hold; sanctions! sanctions!
Topic Started: Aug 11 2017, 01:42 PM (724 Views)
jake58

Siberian
Aug 13 2017, 02:56 AM
the article you posted is a usual manipulation, when I have time later maybe I'll describe how and where :)

Jake, you have not a slightest chance to avoid humiliation, because you don't understand what is going on. And the fact that we're going up and you - down. Description of both will be pleasant to me :)
I was warning you about training :)
And you seem not to understand yet what is required from you :)

You're a really crap troll, Ivan. Your GDP per capita is heading south of Malaysia by 2020, you should be somewhere around the Ivory Coast by 2030... yeah you're trending up... Sweet Jesus, what an idiot.

http://statisticstimes.com/economy/countries-by-projected-gdp-capita.php

your economy is non diversified and a kleptocracy to boot, despite whatever great increases you're trumpeting(how about them tax increases, huh? https://www.cnbc.com/2016/02/29/russia-hikes-gas-tax-25-in-revenue-boosting-bid.html ), the Russian consumer is taking it in the ass, sounds like you like it... not that there's anything wrong with that.
That which can be asserted without evidence; can be dismissed without evidence- Christopher Hitchens
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Siberian
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Jake, I'm not sure you are capable of comprehending more than one idea at once if at all, but I'll put them both here to let you load your brain gyrus with work for the next year or two.

Nominal GDP or income per capita does not matter much. In Germany a cup of tea costs 5 euros, in Russia you can drink tea the whole week for this money.
In rating of GDP per capita measured by purchading power parity we're 48th, right behing Greece.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_GDP_(PPP)_per_capita
Not so brilliant on the first glance, but taking in account what we had in the start and what troubles we went through - it's a good progress and we are growing fast enough.
Second, better concentrate on your own degradation, your personal and of your country, America is a colossus with the clay legs , you are an artificial country whose collapse will be much more disastrous than any other, you are already collapsing - alcoholism and drugs addiction doubles every decade, your state budget on its half consists of borrowing and emission of money, your country is shaken by riots and is on the brink of the civil war, which will start maybe even before your economy collapses along with Dollar and the debt pyramid you have built.
You are mostly brainless zombies ruled in turn by irresponsible warmongering maniacs which even borrow money for invading more and more countrues, you are a disgrace for human kind both on level of the country and you personally, behaving as a savage which too many Americans are.
This may be the reason talking about Russia is so painful for you, you just can't stand that the US is living its last decades as a superpower and maybe as a union which we're used to :) , the US is not capable of surviving what we did.
And if you want a bone just bark, don't try to simulate human talk, it's not yours.... :)
Edited by Siberian, Aug 14 2017, 01:40 AM.
Goood morning GULAG!!!
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Robert Stout
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If a wealthy country faces an economic depression, they must let millions of pet hamsters starve to death......... :shakeshead:
Jesus can raise the dead, but he can't fix stupid
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Siberian
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Robert Stout
Aug 14 2017, 02:27 AM
If a wealthy country faces an economic depression, they must let millions of pet hamsters starve to death......... :shakeshead:
no way, you will need them when hunger strikes.. your approach to risk management is flawed... :)
Otherwise in case of hunger you'll be eaten by such creatures like Jake.
Unless you meant Jake itself.... :)

Edited by Siberian, Aug 14 2017, 03:08 AM.
Goood morning GULAG!!!
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Siberian
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Jake, I think I know the cause of your such a behavior :lol:
Which one did you use? Be careful, dosage for higher organized warm-blooded animals can kill you... :lol:
What a wonderful country ... :lol:

Americans are self-medicating with drugs for animals
https://med.news.am/eng/news/15157/americans-are-self-medicating-with-drugs-for-animals.html
Edited by Siberian, Aug 14 2017, 09:01 AM.
Goood morning GULAG!!!
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jake58

Siberian
Aug 14 2017, 01:31 AM
Jake, I'm not sure you are capable of comprehending more than one idea at once if at all, but I'll put them both here to let you load your brain gyrus with work for the next year or two.

Nominal GDP or income per capita does not matter much. In Germany a cup of tea costs 5 euros, in Russia you can drink tea the whole week for this money.
In rating of GDP per capita measured by purchading power parity we're 48th, right behing Greece.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_GDP_(PPP)_per_capita
Not so brilliant on the first glance, but taking in account what we had in the start and what troubles we went through - it's a good progress and we are growing fast enough.
Second, better concentrate on your own degradation, your personal and of your country, America is a colossus with the clay legs , you are an artificial country whose collapse will be much more disastrous than any other, you are already collapsing - alcoholism and drugs addiction doubles every decade, your state budget on its half consists of borrowing and emission of money, your country is shaken by riots and is on the brink of the civil war, which will start maybe even before your economy collapses along with Dollar and the debt pyramid you have built.
You are mostly brainless zombies ruled in turn by irresponsible warmongering maniacs which even borrow money for invading more and more countrues, you are a disgrace for human kind both on level of the country and you personally, behaving as a savage which too many Americans are.
This may be the reason talking about Russia is so painful for you, you just can't stand that the US is living its last decades as a superpower and maybe as a union which we're used to :) , the US is not capable of surviving what we did.
And if you want a bone just bark, don't try to simulate human talk, it's not yours.... :)
What a surprise, ignore your own pitiful situation and start waving your hands about something else entirely. Does that work on the other boards you embarrass yourself on? Purchasing power, roughly the same position(below Greece :rotflmao: ) and we all know what great shape Greece is in... look you dope, the reason Germans can spend 5 euros for tea is because they make so much more than the average Russian, that was the point of providing GDP per capita. Did the doctors ever tell your parents how long the cord was wrapped around your neck and deprived your brain of oxygen?

Yes, you're growing so fast your GDP per capita keeps dropping like a rock, below Malaysia :rotflmao: . You better ask your masters for the next talking point because you're really crappping the bed on this one. Exports less than half of what they were before sanctions, the ruble , half of what it was before sanctions, ( https://www.cnbc.com/2017/07/25/us-sanctions-have-taken-a-big-bite-out-of-russias-economy.html ) GDP - essentially flat, inflation - about 3x the US rate and trending upwards( https://tradingeconomics.com/russia/inflation-cpi/forecast ), taxes increasing to fill govt revenue holes and we haven't even gotten around to talking about the distribution of wealth where 87% of the country's wealth is held by 10% of the population https://www.theguardian.com/inequality/2017/apr/25/unequal-russia-is-anger-stirring-in-the-global-capital-of-inequality man, that doesn't sound very good. No getting around it dude... Russia sucks.
That which can be asserted without evidence; can be dismissed without evidence- Christopher Hitchens
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Siberian
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Jake, I'm sure I can't fill all gaps in your education, let alone to somehow make you a civilized person out of a savage American, but if you'll find anyone ready to explain to you all I say, here're some tips.
Purchasing power patity is out of your reach, I'll not repeat, ask someone to explain this concept to you.
Well, good for Malaisia if it surpassed Russia and other 5-6 EU member countries (which are below us) in GDP per capita, though being an assembling plant of Japaneze corporations is still not a sustainable economy which Russia still is despite all troubles of collapse of the USSR - what is once again proved by almost zero effect of Western sanctions.
Drop of Dollar nominated export does not mean that we'll start living worse, it means a triator Putin will buy less US treasury bills :) Since most oil revenues were not used and were just stored....
Drop of oil prices and Rouble did not affect Russian economy much , let alone were not a result of sanctions.
You are powerless against Russia and all the US does just makes our economy develop faster and in a more sustainable way. This is the core issue about sanctions and your and our place in the World, learn it by heart.
I wrote it before and I know this idea cannot get inside of your skull, I just love to hear it myself :lol: , it's quite a pleasure to see your helpless fuss with zero effect. :)
Taxes are flat in Russia, on households - 13%. And did not change I think for 2 decades maybe... or more, I don't remember.
You posted something on taxes on benzine - price of 1 liter is about $0,6 or less, twice cheaper than in the EU, I don't know about the US.
To compare our inflation with deflation your Fed is struggling against - you must understand what both means, but before getting to it first learn where North Korea is on the map :) Anyway I'm not going to force this knowledge into your narow mind.
And with Gene (wealth distribution) index (or what is its name?) - yes, I'm afraid we're approaching the US, it's not good....
Anyway, in case you don't understand how pleasant it is to me to watch you being so frustrated, disappointed and loosing human appearance - I inform you - very pleasant :). I like it when Americans behave like apes. Just try not to hurt anyone around.... :)
Edited by Siberian, Aug 14 2017, 10:59 AM.
Goood morning GULAG!!!
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Siberian
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Lol, Jake, I just though, was I judging you too tough? After all you're a typical American, you cannot be expected to be smart enough not to be a victim of US propaganda.

I mean I started reading you article, here's a good piece to start with -

on a shrinking Russian economy - while GDP grow is 2,5%..
- high inflation and a battered currency that has sent capital fleeing - this year we have the smallest inflation in all post-Soviet period. And generally inflation did not prevent economic growth, but now anyway inflation is the smallest :)
capital flow was always a problem, but there're fluctuations and there's no big a change in general. :)

you can hardly find a single word of truth in your CNBC which is supposed to be a business press, i.e. to provide people with actiual trustworthy information to make decisions :lol:

plus
Russia has absolutely insignificant debt/GDP ratio - unlike you
Russia has stable foreign trade proficite - unlike you
Russia has a well balanced realistic state budget with almost zero borrowing - unlike you

What a shameless lie and manipulation your press feeds to you, and you are happy to eat this crap.
I don't approve your taste, Jake, better try some RT, you won't like it because it's true and doesn't provide a pleasant lie to you, but it may make you a less zombie :)
even the bones I reward you with are much more healthy and useful than what you are fed at home...
Edited by Siberian, Aug 14 2017, 11:38 AM.
Goood morning GULAG!!!
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jake58

Siberian
Aug 14 2017, 11:32 AM
Lol, Jake, I just though, was I judging you too tough? After all you're a typical American, you cannot be expected to be smart enough not to be a victim of US propaganda.

I mean I started reading you article, here's a good piece to start with -

on a shrinking Russian economy - while GDP grow is 2,5%..
- high inflation and a battered currency that has sent capital fleeing - this year we have the smallest inflation in all post-Soviet period. And generally inflation did not prevent economic growth, but now anyway inflation is the smallest :)
capital flow was always a problem, but there're fluctuations and there's no big a change in general. :)

you can hardly find a single word of truth in your CNBC which is supposed to be a business press, i.e. to provide people with actiual trustworthy information to make decisions :lol:

plus
Russia has absolutely insignificant debt/GDP ratio - unlike you
Russia has stable foreign trade proficite - unlike you
Russia has a well balanced realistic state budget with almost zero borrowing - unlike you

What a shameless lie and manipulation your press feeds to you, and you are happy to eat this crap.
I don't approve your taste, Jake, better try some RT, you won't like it because it's true and doesn't provide a pleasant lie to you, but it may make you a less zombie :)
even the bones I reward you with are much more healthy and useful than what you are fed at home...
Since you can't compare Russia to the US in any real sense - you're virtually 3rd world in GDP per capita, you're left comparing Russia to ... wait for it... Russia. 'Yes, our inflation rate is 3x the US but we're better than when we were an even crappier economy, you know like when we defaulted back in the late 90s and printed money so that we could screw all our citizens with oppressive inflation rates but stay in power.' Hey, good work there, Ivan.

Taxes are not flat in Russia, that's why the petrol tax was raised 25% last year in order to raise over a billion to not make the deficit look as bad as it was originally(4% of GDP, crikie, that's even worse than ours). Also, would you like to tell the class when the flat tax on income is being phased out in Russia? I hear next year the VAT goes up and income tax rates become more ... 'progressive'... maybe trying to do something about the fact that 10% of your population controls virtually all the money(you rank above the US in that index btw... and didn't you use to be socialist?). How many years in a row have pensions been frozen? And why doesn't the Russian consumer ever complain about taking it in the shorts again and again from this clown show of a govt?

And yes, your public debt is low but that's because most of your debt is 'hidden' in corporations. Russia has one of the largest corporate debts in the world(over 50% of GDP), this is how the govt hides their debt(via state controlled entities like Gazprom). Do you think you're fooling anyone here?

https://group.atradius.com/publications/economic-research-corporate-debt-in-EMEs-may-2016.html

is there anything else I can kick your arse on?
That which can be asserted without evidence; can be dismissed without evidence- Christopher Hitchens
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Siberian
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Lol, Jake, of course there is, it will be jumping throigh the ring of fire or something I'll invent for you, I have not decided yet.. I will not compete with you in this , you will be doing it alone, but under my careful attention and wise supervision. Your training is quite successful, I almost feel being a god, creating a human out of some crap... :lol:
I'll return to economic part later, it requires more a thorough attention while laughing at you does not require any effort, one just have not to resist it :)

Posted Image
Edited by Siberian, Aug 16 2017, 04:00 AM.
Goood morning GULAG!!!
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Siberian
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So, not only I compare Russia of today with Russia of yesterday, I also compare the US now and what it used to be, it brings us the the main thing in which our countries can be compared - we're moving upwards and you are going down.
As well whith what or whom to compare to judge if Western sanctions are capable to make Russia big or some harm? :)

Comparing generally of course Russia is poorer than the US and most of Europe, but we have never been richer and it's hardly achievable with our severe climate, giant distances and lack of cheap sea transportation which automatically makes any production more expensive and investment in infrustructure less effective. Even after the US collapses and Russia reaches its peak of wealth I doubt we'll reach the maximum level of the US.
Does it matter? The US will pass the point of no return in its way to desintegration if level of life there drops for 20% .
You had a moderate stagnation and already your country is drowning in race, social and other kinds of turbulence :)


About budget deficite - well, I have to admit my perseption on US one was a couple of years old, when your deficite was the size of half of the budget, and it's if we don't count the Fed's trillions (as a quazi-state support, i.e. part of the budget) poured to the US economy as a free of charge support to certain sectors of economy, while such support makes up a substantial part of Russian budget by the way.
So, the US managed to temporarily reduce its super-deficite just because they printed and pumped so much money into economy in previous period that they had nobody to invest some more money and needed a break . :)
Interest rate is almost zero, profitability of US business is close to zero. Investments bring almost zero profits. While debt pyramid keeps growing. You economy is a zombie, which is balancing on the brink of bankrupcy.

Then, about Russian debt - you're correct that the debt of the state is uncomoarable to the one of the US :) , while pointing on big debt of Russian private and state corporations you should know that if not most, but too many such credits are given to Russian branches of companies registered abroad, but belonging to the same Russian companies. This is where capital flowvgoes and then cones back in the form of credits to yourself, it is not good since it decreases taxes of course and is a sympthom that oligarkhs don't trust Putin in aspect of security of investments, but this practice was born in 90s and yet was not stopped. But anyway it does not pose a threat which you would like to see and also makes even combined state+corporate debt so significant :)
And regarding the debt of some Gazprom to Western banks - it's rather a problem of these very Western banks than Gazprom :lol: We always have an option of just cancelling these debt since Ukraine refused to pay its debt to Russia and was supported by IMF and the US in this, thus creating a precedent.

The most important aspect is sustainability of the debt, which in your case entirely depends on the interest rate, if big enough it buries you fast, if as low as today - you are killing your banks and pension system. Speakibg broader - it's a dead end, you will not resolve the situation, you will be able just to choose how to collapse :)

On 25% of increas of tax on petrol - since the tax itself is not tha big the price on gasoline grew for 2,5%, which is lower than inflation :) It's a minor event blown by your propaganda out of proportion :)
Benzine in Russia is cheaper than in the US and 2-3 times cheaper than in Europe.

Income tax is 13%, flat and did not change, except several exotic cases as taxation of non-residents, some big lottery awards etc.
Besides, I don't see anything bad in making it progressive, I dob't know why you view such duscussion (yet) as a negative sign for Russia :)
And yes, GINI index of inequality is higher in the US than in Russia.

And Russian consumer doesn't complain because he sees it as a couple of years of just slowing down after 15 years of fast grow, which resumed in spite of Western sanctions :)
Goood morning GULAG!!!
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Robert Stout
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The cost of US oil production from shale is down to $24 a barrel.....The USA will become a bigger oil exporter than Russia.............. :nana:
Jesus can raise the dead, but he can't fix stupid
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Siberian
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Robert Stout
Aug 17 2017, 03:44 AM
The cost of US oil production from shale is down to $24 a barrel.....The USA will become a bigger oil exporter than Russia.............. :nana:
I hope so.
The US has never been a democracy, but the greatest positive feature of US political system was plurality of centers of force, economic power of course with emphasis on industry after the North won the Civil war, which guaranteed more competition in politics and thus faster and more sustainable development.
This positive legacy is being gradually eliminated by present elite (of both parties, except partially Trump, thanks to Bannon and his reindustrialization quest, as I can judge from my little knowledge of the matter) since now they represent major banks mostly or only.
In Russia oil and gas is rather a bane than blessing, interests of national production are sacrificed for sake of oil oligarchy which tie their interests with the West and serve the West.
Now after US confrontation has finally started and deteriorates I am extremely optimistic :) Every move from oil dependency cannot but strengthen Russian economy and independence, promote political prurality, patriotism and faster development.
My personal index of happiness is about 120% :)
Though, unfortunately it must be understood that shale technologies the US uses don't make amount of extractable oil much bigger, what they do is increase of speed extraction, i.e. before you could pump 25 barrels of oil a day from a well during 20 years, now you pump 500 barels a day during 1 year and then just leave a heavilly contaminated area wil destroyed segregation of oil, water etc. horyzons.

So, we have quite a narrow window if opportunities until Americans have not exhausted their reserves fast or suddenly understand that they are destroying environment tgeir children will live in. :)
Edited by Siberian, Aug 17 2017, 04:33 AM.
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Siberian
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Summing up, just 2 thing must be understood and remembered about anti-Russian sanctions.

1) The recent World economic crisis is a crisis of OVERPRODUCTION, the biggest one in History. Access to the markets is priceless.
2) Golden decade of 90s for the US and Western economy was possible only thanks to expansion to former USSR and its satellites' markets. If not this factor the 2008 collapse and further crisis would have happebed much earlier. By mid 00s Russia has reached its bottom in market share, including in its own domestic market. While Russian economy was completely restructured, private business and companies emerged, survived hard 90s and were ready to grow fast if environment was favourable.
But due to having a pro-Western government of Putin our growth was limited to one digit figures. Instead of taking own market and starting expansion abroad Putin was strengthening rouble, encouraging import, and temporarily expanding purchasing power of Russians with credits of Russian banks which were re-credited by Western banks. By 2012 this model was exhausted, stagnation started.
But then suddenly the West sponsored a nazi coup in Ukraine and forced Putun to respond to Western unilateral withdrawal from Russian market (imagine such a disaster :lol: ) with further expulsion of Western business from Russian market. :)
Prompting expansion of Russian business, which is partially limited with burden of previous debts and lack of cheap credit - the legacy of Putin's pro-Western policy prior to 2013. But even despite this Putin's obstruction of Russian business it has now brilliant perspectives, which already resulted in agricultural boom and other sectors with longer investment cycles are to follow :)
Edited by Siberian, Aug 24 2017, 06:01 AM.
Goood morning GULAG!!!
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