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Robert Mueller Sends a Message: He’s Deadly Serious
Topic Started: Oct 28 2017, 03:37 PM (529 Views)
George Aligator
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On Friday night, CNN reported that a grand jury in Washington, D.C., has approved the first charges arising from the special counsel Robert Mueller’s investigation into possible collusion between Donald Trump’s Presidential campaign and the Russian government. Citing “sources briefed on the matter,” the network said that a judge had ordered the charges kept under seal, but that at least one arrest could take place as early as Monday.

Details were scant. The CNN report didn’t specify what the charges were or whom they had been brought against. But the news created an immediate furor, as other news organizations sought to follow up the story, and people on television and social media began speculating about the nature of the charges. Shortly before midnight, the Wall Street Journal confirmed CNN’s scoop, without providing any additional details.

What isn’t speculation is the fact that, five months into his investigation, Mueller has brought a first set of criminal charges. By the standards of recent special prosecutors, that is fast work, and it confirms Mueller’s reputation as someone who doesn’t like to dally. Now that he has started arresting people, there is no reason to suppose he will stop. And that is precisely the message he wants to send.

https://www.newyorker.com/news/our-columnists/robert-mueller-sends-a-message-hes-deadly-serious?mbid=nl_TNY%20Template%20-%20With%20Photo%20(54)&CNDID=29031916&spMailingID=12241737&spUserID=MTMzMTgyOTU2NjcxS0&spJobID=1262480559&spReportId=MTI2MjQ4MDU1OQS2
Conservatism is a social disease
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estonianman
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George Aligator
Oct 28 2017, 03:37 PM
On Friday night, CNN reported that a grand jury in Washington, D.C., has approved the first charges arising from the special counsel Robert Mueller’s investigation into possible collusion between Donald Trump’s Presidential campaign and the Russian government. Citing “sources briefed on the matter,” the network said that a judge had ordered the charges kept under seal, but that at least one arrest could take place as early as Monday.

Details were scant. The CNN report didn’t specify what the charges were or whom they had been brought against. But the news created an immediate furor, as other news organizations sought to follow up the story, and people on television and social media began speculating about the nature of the charges. Shortly before midnight, the Wall Street Journal confirmed CNN’s scoop, without providing any additional details.

What isn’t speculation is the fact that, five months into his investigation, Mueller has brought a first set of criminal charges. By the standards of recent special prosecutors, that is fast work, and it confirms Mueller’s reputation as someone who doesn’t like to dally. Now that he has started arresting people, there is no reason to suppose he will stop. And that is precisely the message he wants to send.

https://www.newyorker.com/news/our-columnists/robert-mueller-sends-a-message-hes-deadly-serious?mbid=nl_TNY%20Template%20-%20With%20Photo%20(54)&CNDID=29031916&spMailingID=12241737&spUserID=MTMzMTgyOTU2NjcxS0&spJobID=1262480559&spReportId=MTI2MjQ4MDU1OQS2
The first sentence is a lie. Mueller is investigating possible interference into the 2016 election, not specifically Trump.

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George Aligator
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estonianman
Oct 28 2017, 03:56 PM
George Aligator
Oct 28 2017, 03:37 PM
On Friday night, CNN reported that a grand jury in Washington, D.C., has approved the first charges arising from the special counsel Robert Mueller’s investigation into possible collusion between Donald Trump’s Presidential campaign and the Russian government. Citing “sources briefed on the matter,” the network said that a judge had ordered the charges kept under seal, but that at least one arrest could take place as early as Monday.

Details were scant. The CNN report didn’t specify what the charges were or whom they had been brought against. But the news created an immediate furor, as other news organizations sought to follow up the story, and people on television and social media began speculating about the nature of the charges. Shortly before midnight, the Wall Street Journal confirmed CNN’s scoop, without providing any additional details.

What isn’t speculation is the fact that, five months into his investigation, Mueller has brought a first set of criminal charges. By the standards of recent special prosecutors, that is fast work, and it confirms Mueller’s reputation as someone who doesn’t like to dally. Now that he has started arresting people, there is no reason to suppose he will stop. And that is precisely the message he wants to send.

https://www.newyorker.com/news/our-columnists/robert-mueller-sends-a-message-hes-deadly-serious?mbid=nl_TNY%20Template%20-%20With%20Photo%20(54)&CNDID=29031916&spMailingID=12241737&spUserID=MTMzMTgyOTU2NjcxS0&spJobID=1262480559&spReportId=MTI2MjQ4MDU1OQS2
The first sentence is a lie. Mueller is investigating possible interference into the 2016 election, not specifically Trump.

You use the word "lie" rather loosely. Dangerous where I come from. Stupid as well because the first sentence references, "collusion between Donald Trump’s Presidential campaign and the Russian government." That is not a statement about "specifically Trump" (meaning the President personally) and it is an accurate description of the law passed to create the Special Investigator.

The days when screaming denial accentuated in purple were treated with bemused tolerance are coming to close as the matter begins its long journey through the courts. You will have no option but to grow up or to shut up. Take your choice.
Conservatism is a social disease
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estonianman
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George Aligator
Oct 28 2017, 05:44 PM
estonianman
Oct 28 2017, 03:56 PM
George Aligator
Oct 28 2017, 03:37 PM
On Friday night, CNN reported that a grand jury in Washington, D.C., has approved the first charges arising from the special counsel Robert Mueller’s investigation into possible collusion between Donald Trump’s Presidential campaign and the Russian government. Citing “sources briefed on the matter,” the network said that a judge had ordered the charges kept under seal, but that at least one arrest could take place as early as Monday.

Details were scant. The CNN report didn’t specify what the charges were or whom they had been brought against. But the news created an immediate furor, as other news organizations sought to follow up the story, and people on television and social media began speculating about the nature of the charges. Shortly before midnight, the Wall Street Journal confirmed CNN’s scoop, without providing any additional details.

What isn’t speculation is the fact that, five months into his investigation, Mueller has brought a first set of criminal charges. By the standards of recent special prosecutors, that is fast work, and it confirms Mueller’s reputation as someone who doesn’t like to dally. Now that he has started arresting people, there is no reason to suppose he will stop. And that is precisely the message he wants to send.

https://www.newyorker.com/news/our-columnists/robert-mueller-sends-a-message-hes-deadly-serious?mbid=nl_TNY%20Template%20-%20With%20Photo%20(54)&CNDID=29031916&spMailingID=12241737&spUserID=MTMzMTgyOTU2NjcxS0&spJobID=1262480559&spReportId=MTI2MjQ4MDU1OQS2
The first sentence is a lie. Mueller is investigating possible interference into the 2016 election, not specifically Trump.

You use the word "lie" rather loosely. Dangerous where I come from. Stupid as well because the first sentence references, "collusion between Donald Trump’s Presidential campaign and the Russian government." That is not a statement about "specifically Trump" (meaning the President personally) and it is an accurate description of the law passed to create the Special Investigator.

The days when screaming denial accentuated in purple were treated with bemused tolerance are coming to close as the matter begins its long journey through the courts. You will have no option but to grow up or to shut up. Take your choice.
That would also be a lie. As was revealed this week - the Podesta brothers are also part of the investigation and last I checked - the Podestas were one step away from the Clinton campaign, not Trump. We have no idea who is going to be indicted Monday - my bets are on Manafort but it could be some IT guy working for the democrats in Pakistan. The people saying that it will be Trump are deeply misinformed and ignorant of the statutes - I believe Trump would need to be impeached prior to being indicted.

nevertheless ....

The investigation encompasses ALL interference in the 2016 election - by both parties with a special focus on Russia.

This is why we call CNN fake news - George.
Edited by estonianman, Oct 28 2017, 06:51 PM.
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We can know two things with pretty much absolute certainty. The first is that the Trump administration is going to throw a mountain of gorilla dust in the air in an effort to convince everyone that there is nothing to see here. And the second is that Robert Mueller, much like the Terminator, isn't going to be dissuaded. And he will not stop until everyone who warrants prosecution, is prosecuted.
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70-101
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In this matter, multiple Grand Juries can only mean one thing, multiple indictments. Conman Kushner's going down very soon, and he leads directly to the Oval office.

Kidnapping, extortion, money laundering, secret rendezvous with commies, lying to federal investigators, lying on government documents that's punishable by imprisonment, and that's just a small part of Flynn's problems.

Flynn's looking at 30 years in the pen, and that's with good behavior.

Conman Kushner's gonna miss his little fashion model when he's in the pen.

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estonianman
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70-101
Oct 29 2017, 01:54 AM
In this matter, multiple Grand Juries can only mean one thing, multiple indictments. Conman Kushner's going down very soon, and he leads directly to the Oval office.

Kidnapping, extortion, money laundering, secret rendezvous with commies, lying to federal investigators, lying on government documents that's punishable by imprisonment, and that's just a small part of Flynn's problems.

Flynn's looking at 30 years in the pen, and that's with good behavior.

Conman Kushner's gonna miss his little fashion model when he's in the pen.

^^ Wipes Tony Podesta's ass for free ^^ ( because he isn't 13 years old)
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The Inquisitor
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70-101
Oct 29 2017, 01:54 AM
In this matter, multiple Grand Juries can only mean one thing, multiple indictments. Conman Kushner's going down very soon, and he leads directly to the Oval office.

Kidnapping, extortion, money laundering, secret rendezvous with commies, lying to federal investigators, lying on government documents that's punishable by imprisonment, and that's just a small part of Flynn's problems.

Flynn's looking at 30 years in the pen, and that's with good behavior.

Conman Kushner's gonna miss his little fashion model when he's in the pen.

"multiple Grand Juries"? :confused:
Warning....Leftist's Post Here....Take Precautions
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70-101
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The Inquisitor
Oct 29 2017, 02:03 AM
70-101
Oct 29 2017, 01:54 AM
In this matter, multiple Grand Juries can only mean one thing, multiple indictments. Conman Kushner's going down very soon, and he leads directly to the Oval office.

Kidnapping, extortion, money laundering, secret rendezvous with commies, lying to federal investigators, lying on government documents that's punishable by imprisonment, and that's just a small part of Flynn's problems.

Flynn's looking at 30 years in the pen, and that's with good behavior.

Conman Kushner's gonna miss his little fashion model when he's in the pen.

"multiple Grand Juries"? :confused:
Eastern District of Virginia and DC
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The Inquisitor
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70-101
Oct 29 2017, 02:07 AM
The Inquisitor
Oct 29 2017, 02:03 AM
70-101
Oct 29 2017, 01:54 AM
In this matter, multiple Grand Juries can only mean one thing, multiple indictments. Conman Kushner's going down very soon, and he leads directly to the Oval office.

Kidnapping, extortion, money laundering, secret rendezvous with commies, lying to federal investigators, lying on government documents that's punishable by imprisonment, and that's just a small part of Flynn's problems.

Flynn's looking at 30 years in the pen, and that's with good behavior.

Conman Kushner's gonna miss his little fashion model when he's in the pen.

"multiple Grand Juries"? :confused:
Eastern District of Virginia and DC
Oh....you mean a couple as in 2....Multiple would be an overstatement wouldn't it? :oyvey
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70-101
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The Inquisitor
Oct 29 2017, 02:19 AM
70-101
Oct 29 2017, 02:07 AM
The Inquisitor
Oct 29 2017, 02:03 AM
70-101
Oct 29 2017, 01:54 AM
In this matter, multiple Grand Juries can only mean one thing, multiple indictments. Conman Kushner's going down very soon, and he leads directly to the Oval office.

Kidnapping, extortion, money laundering, secret rendezvous with commies, lying to federal investigators, lying on government documents that's punishable by imprisonment, and that's just a small part of Flynn's problems.

Flynn's looking at 30 years in the pen, and that's with good behavior.

Conman Kushner's gonna miss his little fashion model when he's in the pen.

"multiple Grand Juries"? :confused:
Eastern District of Virginia and DC
Oh....you mean a couple as in 2....Multiple would be an overstatement wouldn't it? :oyvey
The White House has turned into the Alamo, and all you can do is complain because two isn't a multiple. :rotflmao:
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George Aligator
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estonianman
Oct 28 2017, 06:48 PM
George Aligator
Oct 28 2017, 05:44 PM
estonianman
Oct 28 2017, 03:56 PM
George Aligator
Oct 28 2017, 03:37 PM
On Friday night, CNN reported that a grand jury in Washington, D.C., has approved the first charges arising from the special counsel Robert Mueller’s investigation into possible collusion between Donald Trump’s Presidential campaign and the Russian government. Citing “sources briefed on the matter,” the network said that a judge had ordered the charges kept under seal, but that at least one arrest could take place as early as Monday.

Details were scant. The CNN report didn’t specify what the charges were or whom they had been brought against. But the news created an immediate furor, as other news organizations sought to follow up the story, and people on television and social media began speculating about the nature of the charges. Shortly before midnight, the Wall Street Journal confirmed CNN’s scoop, without providing any additional details.

What isn’t speculation is the fact that, five months into his investigation, Mueller has brought a first set of criminal charges. By the standards of recent special prosecutors, that is fast work, and it confirms Mueller’s reputation as someone who doesn’t like to dally. Now that he has started arresting people, there is no reason to suppose he will stop. And that is precisely the message he wants to send.

https://www.newyorker.com/news/our-columnists/robert-mueller-sends-a-message-hes-deadly-serious?mbid=nl_TNY%20Template%20-%20With%20Photo%20(54)&CNDID=29031916&spMailingID=12241737&spUserID=MTMzMTgyOTU2NjcxS0&spJobID=1262480559&spReportId=MTI2MjQ4MDU1OQS2
The first sentence is a lie. Mueller is investigating possible interference into the 2016 election, not specifically Trump.

You use the word "lie" rather loosely. Dangerous where I come from. Stupid as well because the first sentence references, "collusion between Donald Trump’s Presidential campaign and the Russian government." That is not a statement about "specifically Trump" (meaning the President personally) and it is an accurate description of the law passed to create the Special Investigator.

The days when screaming denial accentuated in purple were treated with bemused tolerance are coming to close as the matter begins its long journey through the courts. You will have no option but to grow up or to shut up. Take your choice.
That would also be a lie. As was revealed this week - the Podesta brothers are also part of the investigation and last I checked - the Podestas were one step away from the Clinton campaign, not Trump. We have no idea who is going to be indicted Monday - my bets are on Manafort but it could be some IT guy working for the democrats in Pakistan. The people saying that it will be Trump are deeply misinformed and ignorant of the statutes - I believe Trump would need to be impeached prior to being indicted.

nevertheless ....

The investigation encompasses ALL interference in the 2016 election - by both parties with a special focus on Russia.

This is why we call CNN fake news - George.
CNN isn't news, it's a TV network. "Fake news" is what you junior fascists call anything that makes you uncomfortable. I'll tell you this though: Trump will be impeached long before Hillary Clinton will. Think it over.
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estonianman
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George Aligator
Oct 29 2017, 03:38 PM
estonianman
Oct 28 2017, 06:48 PM
George Aligator
Oct 28 2017, 05:44 PM
estonianman
Oct 28 2017, 03:56 PM
George Aligator
Oct 28 2017, 03:37 PM
On Friday night, CNN reported that a grand jury in Washington, D.C., has approved the first charges arising from the special counsel Robert Mueller’s investigation into possible collusion between Donald Trump’s Presidential campaign and the Russian government. Citing “sources briefed on the matter,” the network said that a judge had ordered the charges kept under seal, but that at least one arrest could take place as early as Monday.

Details were scant. The CNN report didn’t specify what the charges were or whom they had been brought against. But the news created an immediate furor, as other news organizations sought to follow up the story, and people on television and social media began speculating about the nature of the charges. Shortly before midnight, the Wall Street Journal confirmed CNN’s scoop, without providing any additional details.

What isn’t speculation is the fact that, five months into his investigation, Mueller has brought a first set of criminal charges. By the standards of recent special prosecutors, that is fast work, and it confirms Mueller’s reputation as someone who doesn’t like to dally. Now that he has started arresting people, there is no reason to suppose he will stop. And that is precisely the message he wants to send.

https://www.newyorker.com/news/our-columnists/robert-mueller-sends-a-message-hes-deadly-serious?mbid=nl_TNY%20Template%20-%20With%20Photo%20(54)&CNDID=29031916&spMailingID=12241737&spUserID=MTMzMTgyOTU2NjcxS0&spJobID=1262480559&spReportId=MTI2MjQ4MDU1OQS2
The first sentence is a lie. Mueller is investigating possible interference into the 2016 election, not specifically Trump.

You use the word "lie" rather loosely. Dangerous where I come from. Stupid as well because the first sentence references, "collusion between Donald Trump’s Presidential campaign and the Russian government." That is not a statement about "specifically Trump" (meaning the President personally) and it is an accurate description of the law passed to create the Special Investigator.

The days when screaming denial accentuated in purple were treated with bemused tolerance are coming to close as the matter begins its long journey through the courts. You will have no option but to grow up or to shut up. Take your choice.
That would also be a lie. As was revealed this week - the Podesta brothers are also part of the investigation and last I checked - the Podestas were one step away from the Clinton campaign, not Trump. We have no idea who is going to be indicted Monday - my bets are on Manafort but it could be some IT guy working for the democrats in Pakistan. The people saying that it will be Trump are deeply misinformed and ignorant of the statutes - I believe Trump would need to be impeached prior to being indicted.

nevertheless ....

The investigation encompasses ALL interference in the 2016 election - by both parties with a special focus on Russia.

This is why we call CNN fake news - George.
CNN isn't news, it's a TV network. "Fake news" is what you junior fascists call anything that makes you uncomfortable. I'll tell you this though: Trump will be impeached long before Hillary Clinton will. Think it over.
George - you are the fascist for attempting to subvert a fair election. This isn't Zimbabwe or Venezuela. Hillary isn't Mugabe or Maduro who can change the rules and be dictator for life. You answer to an electorate that has decided you have nothing to offer. I suggest you stop moaning and retool for 2018.

Once again you moan about Trump being impeached. FOR WHAT?

because he hurt your feelings? pfffffft.
Edited by estonianman, Oct 29 2017, 04:42 PM.
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George Aligator
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It says a lot about the mindless loyalty of the Trump mob that its members don't even know the crimes for which he may be impeached. Obstruction of Justice is widely known, as are the violations of election laws concerning foreign governments, there is also evidence of money laundering, perjury and self-dealing. Keep in mind that impeachment is a congressional proceeding, not a judicial one. Proof a a felony, while it would almost certainly produce an impeachment proceeding, is not required for conviction.
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estonianman
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George Aligator
Oct 29 2017, 05:12 PM
It says a lot about the mindless loyalty of the Trump mob that its members don't even know the crimes for which he may be impeached. Obstruction of Justice is widely known, as are the violations of election laws concerning foreign governments, there is also evidence of money laundering, perjury and self-dealing. Keep in mind that impeachment is a congressional proceeding, not a judicial one. Proof a a felony, while it would almost certainly produce an impeachment proceeding, is not required for conviction.
Constitutional lawyers disagree with you regarding your obstruction of justice charge.

and as far as impeachment is concerned - bring it on. It made Bill Clinton practically invisible

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George Aligator
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estonianman
Oct 29 2017, 05:44 PM
George Aligator
Oct 29 2017, 05:12 PM
It says a lot about the mindless loyalty of the Trump mob that its members don't even know the crimes for which he may be impeached. Obstruction of Justice is widely known, as are the violations of election laws concerning foreign governments, there is also evidence of money laundering, perjury and self-dealing. Keep in mind that impeachment is a congressional proceeding, not a judicial one. Proof a a felony, while it would almost certainly produce an impeachment proceeding, is not required for conviction.
Constitutional lawyers disagree with you regarding your obstruction of justice charge.

and as far as impeachment is concerned - bring it on. It made Bill Clinton practically invisible

Your childish response implying that there is some lack of consensus among "Constitutional lawyers" about obstruction of justice shows how ignorant you are about the matter. Obstruction of justice is a criminal, not a constitutional matter. You didn't know that and you don't know what the difference means.

As a criminal matter, the definition is clear in federal codes and nobody disagrees with what the law is. Since you clearly have no idea, I'll give you the relevant first portion:

Whoever corruptly, or by threats or force, or by any threatening letter or communication, endeavors to influence, intimidate, or impede any grand or petit juror, or officer in or of any court of the United States, or officer who may be serving at any examination or other proceeding before any United States magistrate judge or other committing magistrate, in the discharge of his duty, or injures any such grand or petit juror in his person or property on account of any verdict or indictment assented to by him, or on account of his being or having been such juror, or injures any such officer, magistrate judge, or other committing magistrate in his person or property on account of the performance of his official duties, or corruptly or by threats or force, or by any threatening letter or communication, influences, obstructs, or impedes, or endeavors to influence, obstruct, or impede, the due administration of justice, shall be punished as provided in subsection b

What lawyers and jurors may disagree on is the application of the above law to the facts of a specific case. You ought to stop pretending you know anything about the law and stick to repeating Fox News talking points. You look pathetic.
Edited by George Aligator, Oct 29 2017, 06:15 PM.
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estonianman
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George Aligator
Oct 29 2017, 06:13 PM
estonianman
Oct 29 2017, 05:44 PM
George Aligator
Oct 29 2017, 05:12 PM
It says a lot about the mindless loyalty of the Trump mob that its members don't even know the crimes for which he may be impeached. Obstruction of Justice is widely known, as are the violations of election laws concerning foreign governments, there is also evidence of money laundering, perjury and self-dealing. Keep in mind that impeachment is a congressional proceeding, not a judicial one. Proof a a felony, while it would almost certainly produce an impeachment proceeding, is not required for conviction.
Constitutional lawyers disagree with you regarding your obstruction of justice charge.

and as far as impeachment is concerned - bring it on. It made Bill Clinton practically invisible

Your childish response implying that there is some lack of consensus among "Constitutional lawyers" about obstruction of justice shows how ignorant you are about the matter. Obstruction of justice is a criminal, not a constitutional matter. You didn't know that and you don't know what the difference means.

As a criminal matter, the definition is clear in federal codes and nobody disagrees with what the law is. Since you clearly have no idea, I'll give you the relevant first portion:

Whoever corruptly, or by threats or force, or by any threatening letter or communication, endeavors to influence, intimidate, or impede any grand or petit juror, or officer in or of any court of the United States, or officer who may be serving at any examination or other proceeding before any United States magistrate judge or other committing magistrate, in the discharge of his duty, or injures any such grand or petit juror in his person or property on account of any verdict or indictment assented to by him, or on account of his being or having been such juror, or injures any such officer, magistrate judge, or other committing magistrate in his person or property on account of the performance of his official duties, or corruptly or by threats or force, or by any threatening letter or communication, influences, obstructs, or impedes, or endeavors to influence, obstruct, or impede, the due administration of justice, shall be punished as provided in subsection b

What lawyers and jurors may disagree on is the application of the above law to the facts of a specific case. You ought to stop pretending you know anything about the law and stick to repeating Fox News talking points. You look pathetic.
Its a constitutional issue because of the separation of powers, george

Egg on your face :)
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George Aligator
Oct 29 2017, 06:13 PM

What lawyers and jurors may disagree on is the application of the above law to the facts of a specific case. You ought to stop pretending you know anything about the law and stick to repeating Fox News talking points. You look pathetic.
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George Aligator
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estonianman
Oct 29 2017, 06:22 PM
George Aligator
Oct 29 2017, 06:13 PM
estonianman
Oct 29 2017, 05:44 PM
George Aligator
Oct 29 2017, 05:12 PM
It says a lot about the mindless loyalty of the Trump mob that its members don't even know the crimes for which he may be impeached. Obstruction of Justice is widely known, as are the violations of election laws concerning foreign governments, there is also evidence of money laundering, perjury and self-dealing. Keep in mind that impeachment is a congressional proceeding, not a judicial one. Proof a a felony, while it would almost certainly produce an impeachment proceeding, is not required for conviction.
Constitutional lawyers disagree with you regarding your obstruction of justice charge.

and as far as impeachment is concerned - bring it on. It made Bill Clinton practically invisible

Your childish response implying that there is some lack of consensus among "Constitutional lawyers" about obstruction of justice shows how ignorant you are about the matter. Obstruction of justice is a criminal, not a constitutional matter. You didn't know that and you don't know what the difference means.

As a criminal matter, the definition is clear in federal codes and nobody disagrees with what the law is. Since you clearly have no idea, I'll give you the relevant first portion:

Whoever corruptly, or by threats or force, or by any threatening letter or communication, endeavors to influence, intimidate, or impede any grand or petit juror, or officer in or of any court of the United States, or officer who may be serving at any examination or other proceeding before any United States magistrate judge or other committing magistrate, in the discharge of his duty, or injures any such grand or petit juror in his person or property on account of any verdict or indictment assented to by him, or on account of his being or having been such juror, or injures any such officer, magistrate judge, or other committing magistrate in his person or property on account of the performance of his official duties, or corruptly or by threats or force, or by any threatening letter or communication, influences, obstructs, or impedes, or endeavors to influence, obstruct, or impede, the due administration of justice, shall be punished as provided in subsection b

What lawyers and jurors may disagree on is the application of the above law to the facts of a specific case. You ought to stop pretending you know anything about the law and stick to repeating Fox News talking points. You look pathetic.
Its a constitutional issue because of the separation of powers, george

Egg on your face :)
No, the separation of powers deals with the relationship between constitutional offices, it does not define criminal acts. The separation issue has been cited in the argument that the President cannot be criminally indicted while in office. That he cannot be indicted is not the same as saying he cannot commit a crime.* The evidence of obstruction of justice alleged by the President is presented to the Congress, not the courts. If convicted, the president is removed from office, not subjected to criminal penalty. But the res delicto remains untouched. The president can commit a crime but how the act is handled is different from what happens when you do.

*this distinction is relevant in the Trump Russia issue because although Trump cannot be criminally prosecuted, people acting in collusion with him or under his direction can be criminally prosecuted as part of criminal conspiracy.
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estonianman
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George Aligator
Oct 29 2017, 06:36 PM
estonianman
Oct 29 2017, 06:22 PM
George Aligator
Oct 29 2017, 06:13 PM
estonianman
Oct 29 2017, 05:44 PM
George Aligator
Oct 29 2017, 05:12 PM
It says a lot about the mindless loyalty of the Trump mob that its members don't even know the crimes for which he may be impeached. Obstruction of Justice is widely known, as are the violations of election laws concerning foreign governments, there is also evidence of money laundering, perjury and self-dealing. Keep in mind that impeachment is a congressional proceeding, not a judicial one. Proof a a felony, while it would almost certainly produce an impeachment proceeding, is not required for conviction.
Constitutional lawyers disagree with you regarding your obstruction of justice charge.

and as far as impeachment is concerned - bring it on. It made Bill Clinton practically invisible

Your childish response implying that there is some lack of consensus among "Constitutional lawyers" about obstruction of justice shows how ignorant you are about the matter. Obstruction of justice is a criminal, not a constitutional matter. You didn't know that and you don't know what the difference means.

As a criminal matter, the definition is clear in federal codes and nobody disagrees with what the law is. Since you clearly have no idea, I'll give you the relevant first portion:

Whoever corruptly, or by threats or force, or by any threatening letter or communication, endeavors to influence, intimidate, or impede any grand or petit juror, or officer in or of any court of the United States, or officer who may be serving at any examination or other proceeding before any United States magistrate judge or other committing magistrate, in the discharge of his duty, or injures any such grand or petit juror in his person or property on account of any verdict or indictment assented to by him, or on account of his being or having been such juror, or injures any such officer, magistrate judge, or other committing magistrate in his person or property on account of the performance of his official duties, or corruptly or by threats or force, or by any threatening letter or communication, influences, obstructs, or impedes, or endeavors to influence, obstruct, or impede, the due administration of justice, shall be punished as provided in subsection b

What lawyers and jurors may disagree on is the application of the above law to the facts of a specific case. You ought to stop pretending you know anything about the law and stick to repeating Fox News talking points. You look pathetic.
Its a constitutional issue because of the separation of powers, george

Egg on your face :)
No, the separation of powers deals with the relationship between constitutional offices, it does not define criminal acts. The separation issue has been cited in the argument that the President cannot be criminally indicted while in office. That he cannot be indicted is not the same as saying he cannot commit a crime.* The evidence of obstruction of justice alleged by the President is presented to the Congress, not the courts. If convicted, the president is removed from office, not subjected to criminal penalty. But the res delicto remains untouched. The president can commit a crime but how the act is handled is different from what happens when you do.

*this distinction is relevant in the Trump Russia issue because although Trump cannot be criminally prosecuted, people acting in collusion with him or under his direction can be criminally prosecuted as part of criminal conspiracy.
Trump has every right as POTUS and defined by the separation of powers to fire his subordinates - for any reason he wants. There is consensus supporting my position - all you have is a mob of leftist crybabies on a witchhunt.

You are basing this on your theory that a crime took place. No crime took place. :)
Edited by estonianman, Oct 29 2017, 07:00 PM.
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