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Trump's core supporters won't reject him. It would mean rejecting their own values.
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Topic Started: Feb 11 2018, 01:04 PM (701 Views)
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RaiderNation
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Feb 13 2018, 07:20 AM
Post #21
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- Harambe4Trump
- Feb 11 2018, 08:47 PM
- RaiderNation
- Feb 11 2018, 03:47 PM
You misunderstand Fashy. I didn't say that, only that he and his little band of trumpsters can't win again. He fooled many who won't help him next time. BUT, there may not be a next time for him.
There wasn’t a next time for Polk, Lincoln, McKinley, JFK, or LBJ either. Their impact endures. Such is your implication. No. That may be your inference, but I did not imply anything like that. Perhaps have an adult explain the difference between the two for you.
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Will Munny: "Deserve's got nothin' to do with it..."
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Robert Stout
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Feb 13 2018, 08:22 AM
Post #22
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- RaiderNation
- Feb 13 2018, 07:20 AM
- Harambe4Trump
- Feb 11 2018, 08:47 PM
- RaiderNation
- Feb 11 2018, 03:47 PM
You misunderstand Fashy. I didn't say that, only that he and his little band of trumpsters can't win again. He fooled many who won't help him next time. BUT, there may not be a next time for him.
There wasn’t a next time for Polk, Lincoln, McKinley, JFK, or LBJ either. Their impact endures. Such is your implication.
No. That may be your inference, but I did not imply anything like that. Perhaps have an adult explain the difference between the two for you. Perhaps Trump already has won in 2020, due to the tax cut and the Democrats inability to find a viable candidate or platform....Saving Obamacare, trade treaties, and DACA illegals does not inspire voters................ :oyvey
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Jesus can raise the dead, but he can't fix stupid
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thoughtless
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Feb 13 2018, 11:05 AM
Post #23
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- Right-Wing
- Feb 12 2018, 10:18 PM
- thoughtless
- Feb 12 2018, 02:03 PM
OK, I realize the Trump supporters here don't like Obama or Clinton, but I'm curious, do any of you disagree with the cited article, or does it even matter to you what the article says?
Stupid article for stupid people written by a stupid partisan hack... Yes people follow leaders because those leaders share the values of their followers (or at least profess to); and followers tend to abandon those leaders when the leaders abandon those values. This is what happened to the Republican Party in 2010 and 2016 and what is currently happening to the democrat party. If Trump betrays his constituents he will be abandoned; as would any democrat who did the same... You missed the point of the article which is that his followers will continue to follow him as long as they believe he shares their values.
It doesn't matter that he made promises he can't keep, or that he doesn't deliver on those promises. Trump follower's don't care if Mexico doesn't pay for the wall, and that he was bulls**tting them when he said so, they only care that he's on "their side".
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Without geometry, life is pointless.
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jake58
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Feb 13 2018, 11:31 AM
Post #24
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- thoughtless
- Feb 13 2018, 11:05 AM
- Right-Wing
- Feb 12 2018, 10:18 PM
- thoughtless
- Feb 12 2018, 02:03 PM
OK, I realize the Trump supporters here don't like Obama or Clinton, but I'm curious, do any of you disagree with the cited article, or does it even matter to you what the article says?
Stupid article for stupid people written by a stupid partisan hack... Yes people follow leaders because those leaders share the values of their followers (or at least profess to); and followers tend to abandon those leaders when the leaders abandon those values. This is what happened to the Republican Party in 2010 and 2016 and what is currently happening to the democrat party. If Trump betrays his constituents he will be abandoned; as would any democrat who did the same...
You missed the point of the article which is that his followers will continue to follow him as long as they believe he shares their values. It doesn't matter that he made promises he can't keep, or that he doesn't deliver on those promises. Trump follower's don't care if Mexico doesn't pay for the wall, and that he was bulls**tting them when he said so, they only care that he's on "their side". I'm not sure why this would be a surprise to anyone, esp coming from the pen of someone who headed a liberal think tank. After 2 terms Guantanamo was still open, doubt Hopey Changey dude lost many peeps over that. Trump's inability to deliver any or all of his promises will be blamed on someone else, as pretty much every President has done. His rhetoric matches up with the general consensus of his followers, immigration from the South= bad, too much govt=bad, strong defense=good, taxes should be lower, tougher on foreign policy, etc. I get you don't like most of his policies but there was enough people who did... and they felt that they had been left behind and that their govt didn't speak for them over the last 30 years. Whether you, me or everyone else thinks he's a boorish twat is ancillary, 2020 will depend on who the Dems put up. If they trend to the left, I expect it won't turn in their favor.
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That which can be asserted without evidence; can be dismissed without evidence- Christopher Hitchens
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CautionaryTales
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Feb 13 2018, 12:27 PM
Post #25
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- Coast2coast
- Feb 11 2018, 08:46 PM
The problem with that theory is that conservatism has no values that they will stick to. Their values, their principles, their morals all set on greased rails and slid around to any location that works for those five minuets.
Didn't used to be that way but that was then and this is them now.
They have proven that they share values with Trump. All of them that share those values are a gang of whores and thieves They can’t go back
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Have you paid your internet taxes?
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thoughtless
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Feb 13 2018, 12:30 PM
Post #26
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- jake58
- Feb 13 2018, 11:31 AM
- thoughtless
- Feb 13 2018, 11:05 AM
- Right-Wing
- Feb 12 2018, 10:18 PM
- thoughtless
- Feb 12 2018, 02:03 PM
OK, I realize the Trump supporters here don't like Obama or Clinton, but I'm curious, do any of you disagree with the cited article, or does it even matter to you what the article says?
Stupid article for stupid people written by a stupid partisan hack... Yes people follow leaders because those leaders share the values of their followers (or at least profess to); and followers tend to abandon those leaders when the leaders abandon those values. This is what happened to the Republican Party in 2010 and 2016 and what is currently happening to the democrat party. If Trump betrays his constituents he will be abandoned; as would any democrat who did the same...
You missed the point of the article which is that his followers will continue to follow him as long as they believe he shares their values. It doesn't matter that he made promises he can't keep, or that he doesn't deliver on those promises. Trump follower's don't care if Mexico doesn't pay for the wall, and that he was bulls**tting them when he said so, they only care that he's on "their side".
I'm not sure why this would be a surprise to anyone, esp coming from the pen of someone who headed a liberal think tank. After 2 terms Guantanamo was still open, doubt Hopey Changey dude lost many peeps over that. Trump's inability to deliver any or all of his promises will be blamed on someone else, as pretty much every President has done. His rhetoric matches up with the general consensus of his followers, immigration from the South= bad, too much govt=bad, strong defense=good, taxes should be lower, tougher on foreign policy, etc. I get you don't like most of his policies but there was enough people who did... and they felt that they had been left behind and that their govt didn't speak for them over the last 30 years. Whether you, me or everyone else thinks he's a boorish twat is ancillary, 2020 will depend on who the Dems put up. If they trend to the left, I expect it won't turn in their favor. I don't see the "age of Trump" having that much similarity to the feeling folks have had toward the presidency in the past.
The root of it is due to the extreme polarization in politics, particularly with reference to Trump. Let's face it, everybody that doesn't love Donald Trump, hates his guts. It's more like some religion, than politics. There's been some of that with past presidents, but not nearly on the scale that we see today. It appears to have little to do with issues, and a lot more to do with whose side you belong to.
The question comes down to "what would have to happen, for someone entrenched on their position regarding Trump, to change sides". Those that think he's dishonest, aren't suddenly going to start thinking otherwise, if he gets more truthful. Those that believe every word he says, will continue to believe what he says, if he starts saying something completely different.
Trump has a loyal base that he can count on in 2020, but he's been unable to expand that base. In fact, he appears to have no interest in doing so. You're right about the Dems though. All they have to do, is run someone that's a little less hated than Trump, and the election is theirs. I don't count on them having that ability.
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Without geometry, life is pointless.
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PATruth
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Feb 13 2018, 12:30 PM
Post #27
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Trump loves his country, Obama was never proud of his country while Hillary loved selling her country.
Yep, those are values I share.
I won't go back and I'm proud of it!
Edited by PATruth, Feb 13 2018, 12:31 PM.
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"No. No he won't. We'll stop it."
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jake58
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Feb 13 2018, 12:50 PM
Post #28
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- thoughtless
- Feb 13 2018, 12:30 PM
- jake58
- Feb 13 2018, 11:31 AM
- thoughtless
- Feb 13 2018, 11:05 AM
- Right-Wing
- Feb 12 2018, 10:18 PM
- thoughtless
- Feb 12 2018, 02:03 PM
OK, I realize the Trump supporters here don't like Obama or Clinton, but I'm curious, do any of you disagree with the cited article, or does it even matter to you what the article says?
Stupid article for stupid people written by a stupid partisan hack... Yes people follow leaders because those leaders share the values of their followers (or at least profess to); and followers tend to abandon those leaders when the leaders abandon those values. This is what happened to the Republican Party in 2010 and 2016 and what is currently happening to the democrat party. If Trump betrays his constituents he will be abandoned; as would any democrat who did the same...
You missed the point of the article which is that his followers will continue to follow him as long as they believe he shares their values. It doesn't matter that he made promises he can't keep, or that he doesn't deliver on those promises. Trump follower's don't care if Mexico doesn't pay for the wall, and that he was bulls**tting them when he said so, they only care that he's on "their side".
I'm not sure why this would be a surprise to anyone, esp coming from the pen of someone who headed a liberal think tank. After 2 terms Guantanamo was still open, doubt Hopey Changey dude lost many peeps over that. Trump's inability to deliver any or all of his promises will be blamed on someone else, as pretty much every President has done. His rhetoric matches up with the general consensus of his followers, immigration from the South= bad, too much govt=bad, strong defense=good, taxes should be lower, tougher on foreign policy, etc. I get you don't like most of his policies but there was enough people who did... and they felt that they had been left behind and that their govt didn't speak for them over the last 30 years. Whether you, me or everyone else thinks he's a boorish twat is ancillary, 2020 will depend on who the Dems put up. If they trend to the left, I expect it won't turn in their favor.
I don't see the "age of Trump" having that much similarity to the feeling folks have had toward the presidency in the past. The root of it is due to the extreme polarization in politics, particularly with reference to Trump. Let's face it, everybody that doesn't love Donald Trump, hates his guts. It's more like some religion, than politics. There's been some of that with past presidents, but not nearly on the scale that we see today. It appears to have little to do with issues, and a lot more to do with whose side you belong to. The question comes down to "what would have to happen, for someone entrenched on their position regarding Trump, to change sides". Those that think he's dishonest, aren't suddenly going to start thinking otherwise, if he gets more truthful. Those that believe every word he says, will continue to believe what he says, if he starts saying something completely different. Trump has a loyal base that he can count on in 2020, but he's been unable to expand that base. In fact, he appears to have no interest in doing so. You're right about the Dems though. All they have to do, is run someone that's a little less hated than Trump, and the election is theirs. I don't count on them having that ability. Yup, politics has become a lot more polarized and it didn't start with Trump. I remember the Bush years... or the Obama years if you prefer. There's a certain demographic that really HATES the other side, the biggest hypocrites are the ones who put those 'Hate has no place here' signs in their front yard while posting hate filled screeds about Trump on Facebook. Maybe the biggest difference is that Trump doesn't care. He's not your typical pol. He doesn't shade things so you might not know where he stands, he just says it and lets the chips fall. I doubt Trump feels any loyalty to the Republican brand other than as a means to pass legislation he would like. His only loyalty is to himself.
And to answer your question about what would need to happen to have someone change sides, you would have to ask one of the few independents left at this point. I think everyone has pretty much chosen sides. Maybe a war or a severe economic downturn... both of which are possible.
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That which can be asserted without evidence; can be dismissed without evidence- Christopher Hitchens
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Right-Wing
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Feb 13 2018, 01:43 PM
Post #29
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- thoughtless
- Feb 13 2018, 11:05 AM
- Right-Wing
- Feb 12 2018, 10:18 PM
- thoughtless
- Feb 12 2018, 02:03 PM
OK, I realize the Trump supporters here don't like Obama or Clinton, but I'm curious, do any of you disagree with the cited article, or does it even matter to you what the article says?
Stupid article for stupid people written by a stupid partisan hack... Yes people follow leaders because those leaders share the values of their followers (or at least profess to); and followers tend to abandon those leaders when the leaders abandon those values. This is what happened to the Republican Party in 2010 and 2016 and what is currently happening to the democrat party. If Trump betrays his constituents he will be abandoned; as would any democrat who did the same...
You missed the point of the article which is that his followers will continue to follow him as long as they believe he shares their values. It doesn't matter that he made promises he can't keep, or that he doesn't deliver on those promises. Trump follower's don't care if Mexico doesn't pay for the wall, and that he was bulls**tting them when he said so, they only care that he's on "their side". I fully got the point of the article. An attempt to spin the fundamental nature of politics and leadership into appearing like some sort of cult hero worship when it comes to Trump supporters.
People follow leaders who they believe share their goals and values and actively work to achieve those goals. People abandon leaders when they believe the leaders abandon those goals.
What promises can't Trump keep? A wall? I'd say a wall is still on the table. Mexico paying for it? You never know what tools Trump and his team have up their sleeve to make that happen so you can't actually rule it out as being a possibility.
Hell, a significant reduction in illegal immigration from Mexico thanks to the wall would result in a significant reduction in USD remittances to Mexico ($30B sent in 2017 alone) which would mean...voila...Mexico pays for the wall!
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Donald Trump is Barack Obama's President!
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Right-Wing
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Feb 13 2018, 01:58 PM
Post #30
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- thoughtless
- Feb 13 2018, 11:05 AM
- Right-Wing
- Feb 12 2018, 10:18 PM
- thoughtless
- Feb 12 2018, 02:03 PM
OK, I realize the Trump supporters here don't like Obama or Clinton, but I'm curious, do any of you disagree with the cited article, or does it even matter to you what the article says?
Stupid article for stupid people written by a stupid partisan hack... Yes people follow leaders because those leaders share the values of their followers (or at least profess to); and followers tend to abandon those leaders when the leaders abandon those values. This is what happened to the Republican Party in 2010 and 2016 and what is currently happening to the democrat party. If Trump betrays his constituents he will be abandoned; as would any democrat who did the same...
You missed the point of the article which is that his followers will continue to follow him as long as they believe he shares their values. It doesn't matter that he made promises he can't keep, or that he doesn't deliver on those promises. Trump follower's don't care if Mexico doesn't pay for the wall, and that he was bulls**tting them when he said so, they only care that he's on "their side". Truthfully you missed the point of the article...
It's a blatant attempt to dehumanize and delegitimize Trump supporters by likening them to brainwashed cultists.
Typical leftist bullsh*t the Nazis and Communists are known for. "If you don't think like us you're defective or evil and must be destroyed!"
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Donald Trump is Barack Obama's President!
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Robert Stout
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Feb 13 2018, 02:33 PM
Post #31
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- Right-Wing
- Feb 13 2018, 01:58 PM
- thoughtless
- Feb 13 2018, 11:05 AM
- Right-Wing
- Feb 12 2018, 10:18 PM
- thoughtless
- Feb 12 2018, 02:03 PM
OK, I realize the Trump supporters here don't like Obama or Clinton, but I'm curious, do any of you disagree with the cited article, or does it even matter to you what the article says?
Stupid article for stupid people written by a stupid partisan hack... Yes people follow leaders because those leaders share the values of their followers (or at least profess to); and followers tend to abandon those leaders when the leaders abandon those values. This is what happened to the Republican Party in 2010 and 2016 and what is currently happening to the democrat party. If Trump betrays his constituents he will be abandoned; as would any democrat who did the same...
You missed the point of the article which is that his followers will continue to follow him as long as they believe he shares their values. It doesn't matter that he made promises he can't keep, or that he doesn't deliver on those promises. Trump follower's don't care if Mexico doesn't pay for the wall, and that he was bulls**tting them when he said so, they only care that he's on "their side".
Truthfully you missed the point of the article... It's a blatant attempt to dehumanize and delegitimize Trump supporters by likening them to brainwashed cultists. Typical leftist bullsh*t the Nazis and Communists are known for. "If you don't think like us you're defective or evil and must be destroyed!" Liberals assume they are the only real humans on the planet..............
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Jesus can raise the dead, but he can't fix stupid
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Robertr2000
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Feb 13 2018, 02:50 PM
Post #32
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- thoughtless
- Feb 12 2018, 03:04 PM
- Robertr2000
- Feb 12 2018, 02:20 PM
- thoughtless
- Feb 12 2018, 02:03 PM
OK, I realize the Trump supporters here don't like Obama or Clinton, but I'm curious, do any of you disagree with the cited article, or does it even matter to you what the article says? The article is crap so..... no.
What is important is what does or is the Liberal side offering next time around? Give it a shot. I am listening.
If it is LGBTQWMNOSTYXZ...... illegals..... Socialism.... communism...... i.e. Bigger Government, save it. I'm voting Trump.
In your earlier post you stated "Trumps values are my values. Why would I reject them", which is exactly what was described in the article. In fact, the article seems to describe you to a "T". What is your point, to calling it a "crap article"? My first response was "this article is crap". Because.... it's crap. Fake "news". Those are not Trumps values, they are not my values.
So what are the Democrats offering this time around? Something different? or same-old same old?
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"if that **** wins we'll all hang from nooses"
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thoughtless
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Feb 13 2018, 03:21 PM
Post #33
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- Robertr2000
- Feb 13 2018, 02:50 PM
- thoughtless
- Feb 12 2018, 03:04 PM
- Robertr2000
- Feb 12 2018, 02:20 PM
- thoughtless
- Feb 12 2018, 02:03 PM
OK, I realize the Trump supporters here don't like Obama or Clinton, but I'm curious, do any of you disagree with the cited article, or does it even matter to you what the article says? The article is crap so..... no.
What is important is what does or is the Liberal side offering next time around? Give it a shot. I am listening.
If it is LGBTQWMNOSTYXZ...... illegals..... Socialism.... communism...... i.e. Bigger Government, save it. I'm voting Trump.
In your earlier post you stated "Trumps values are my values. Why would I reject them", which is exactly what was described in the article. In fact, the article seems to describe you to a "T". What is your point, to calling it a "crap article"? My first response was "this article is crap". Because.... it's crap. Fake "news". Those are not Trumps values, they are not my values.
So what are the Democrats offering this time around? Something different? or same-old same old? Your post #14 was "Trumps values are my values. Why would I reject them ", and #15 was "this article is crap".
Now you're saying "Those are not Trumps values, they are not my values"and that makes the article fake. The odd thing about that is that the article doesn't discuss whether Trump's values are good or bad, or even what they are, but instead points out the degree of support he gets from those that share his values, which is exactly what you confirmed in the first post.
:oyvey
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Without geometry, life is pointless.
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Mr. Tik
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Feb 13 2018, 04:39 PM
Post #34
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- Right-Wing
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Truthfully you missed the point of the article...
It's a blatant attempt to dehumanize and delegitimize Trump supporters by likening them to brainwashed cultists.
Typical leftist bullsh*t the Nazis and Communists are known for. "If you don't think like us you're defective or evil and must be destroyed!" LOL..Right wing is so cracked out that he doesnt even see the naked irony of what he just posted.
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You may be a conservative republican..if you are pro life until you get your mistress knocked up
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Mr. Tik
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Feb 13 2018, 04:40 PM
Post #35
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- Robert Stout
- Feb 13 2018, 02:33 PM
Liberals assume they are the only real humans on the planet.............. And stout rolls in for the double derp..you can't make this crap up.
Is Truthie gonna come in and make this a trifecta?
Edited by Mr. Tik, Feb 13 2018, 04:43 PM.
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You may be a conservative republican..if you are pro life until you get your mistress knocked up
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Sammy
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Feb 13 2018, 04:43 PM
Post #36
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- Mr. Tik
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Liberals assume they are the only real humans on the planet..............
And stout rolls in for the double derp..you can't make this crap up. Don't forget us ALIENS!!!! Which Liberal is going to Run against Trump , if Trump does run again..... Sammy
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Please stay away from MARS
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Mr. Tik
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Feb 13 2018, 04:53 PM
Post #37
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- Sammy
- Feb 13 2018, 04:43 PM
- Mr. Tik
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- Robert Stout
- Feb 13 2018, 02:33 PM
Liberals assume they are the only real humans on the planet..............
And stout rolls in for the double derp..you can't make this crap up.  Don't forget us ALIENS!!!! Which Liberal is going to Run against Trump , if Trump does run again.....  Sammy And then we we have trumpy who thinks he is a martian...good times.
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You may be a conservative republican..if you are pro life until you get your mistress knocked up
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Coast2coast
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Feb 13 2018, 05:49 PM
Post #38
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- PATruth
- Feb 13 2018, 12:30 PM
Trump loves his country, Obama was never proud of his country while Hillary loved selling her country.
Yep, those are values I share.
I won't go back and I'm proud of it! When I hear a conservative offer a line like this they are declaring "Don't take me seriously".
Both men love this country. Hillary is not selling this nation either. That's just not a supportable statement.
But President Trump won't be a President of the United Stated for the United States in the face of Russia.
Dance all you like. It's ongoing right now in front of you if you wish to be honest enough to drop your politics for your country.
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Robertr2000
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Feb 13 2018, 06:11 PM
Post #39
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- thoughtless
- Feb 13 2018, 03:21 PM
- Robertr2000
- Feb 13 2018, 02:50 PM
- thoughtless
- Feb 12 2018, 03:04 PM
- Robertr2000
- Feb 12 2018, 02:20 PM
- thoughtless
- Feb 12 2018, 02:03 PM
OK, I realize the Trump supporters here don't like Obama or Clinton, but I'm curious, do any of you disagree with the cited article, or does it even matter to you what the article says? The article is crap so..... no.
What is important is what does or is the Liberal side offering next time around? Give it a shot. I am listening.
If it is LGBTQWMNOSTYXZ...... illegals..... Socialism.... communism...... i.e. Bigger Government, save it. I'm voting Trump.
In your earlier post you stated "Trumps values are my values. Why would I reject them", which is exactly what was described in the article. In fact, the article seems to describe you to a "T". What is your point, to calling it a "crap article"? My first response was "this article is crap". Because.... it's crap. Fake "news". Those are not Trumps values, they are not my values.
So what are the Democrats offering this time around? Something different? or same-old same old?
Your post #14 was "Trumps values are my values. Why would I reject them ", and #15 was "this article is crap". Now you're saying "Those are not Trumps values, they are not my values"and that makes the article fake. The odd thing about that is that the article doesn't discuss whether Trump's values are good or bad, or even what they are, but instead points out the degree of support he gets from those that share his values, which is exactly what you confirmed in the first post. :oyvey I read the article, the responded. Did you?
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"if that **** wins we'll all hang from nooses"
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clone
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Feb 13 2018, 08:18 PM
Post #40
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Director @ Center for Advanced Memetic Warfare
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- Coast2coast
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- PATruth
- Feb 13 2018, 12:30 PM
Trump loves his country, Obama was never proud of his country while Hillary loved selling her country.
Yep, those are values I share.
I won't go back and I'm proud of it!
When I hear a conservative offer a line like this they are declaring "Don't take me seriously". Both men love this country. Hillary is not selling this nation either. That's just not a supportable statement. But President Trump won't be a President of the United Stated for the United States in the face of Russia. Dance all you like. It's ongoing right now in front of you if you wish to be honest enough to drop your politics for your country. We did which is why Trump won and as long as you people keep playing politics instead of dropping them and joining us to make America great again Daddy will continue to have my support....
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Only liberals can choose not to go down the road to widespread, systematic violence.
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