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Pedro Sánchez is sworn in as Spain's new prime minister
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Topic Started: Jun 2 2018, 12:23 PM (707 Views)
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W A Mozart
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Jun 12 2018, 03:39 PM
Post #61
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- Hughmac
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- W A Mozart
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And oh by the way, to really grasp the insanity here you need to look at this map, ...er, logistics....  Rather than bringing the 'migrants' back to Libya, which would be the SHORTEST route, the socialist/commie leader of Spain decided to welcome the new, and all, immigrants to Spain! "Hey, we'll leave the light on for you...!" They may even provide each and every one of them "a rucksack," some candy bars and a map, with a highlighted foot path over the Pyrenees. I am sure all of Spain is just thrilled, ... This is a perfect example as to how the 'far' left has destroyed Europe. Mozart
Right, reality check: Libya doesn't have a government; as a state it ceased to exist, thanks to the Brits and French taking out Gaddafi. There is nobody, therefore, in Libya that is going to receive them and keep them there. Let's see if I can explain this to you... Spain has an agreement with Morocco so that when illegal immigrants make it to Spain from Morocco, Spain flies them straight back and the Moroccan police are waiting for them when they land. Keep paying attention... Italy had such an agreement with Libya; i.e. Gaddafi, and it worked pretty well until France and the UK screwed it up. Now nobody in Libya is taking them back. Instead, it's the people-smuggling mafia that is running the coasts and ports. Are you getting an inkling of common sense running through the tortured caverns of you mind, my most excellent friend? Spain accepted those immigrants because by doing so it put the problem back into the EU's lap. OK, hold that thought. Now let's move onto the ship, Aquarius. It has 650 refugees onboard and it only has a carry capacity for just over a hundred. The ship cannot take a long journey in these conditions, not to mention the lack of supplies, water and you name it. Which is why Italy has now offered two ships to accompany the Aquarius to Valencia by sharing the passengers and providing the supplies. Corsica, which is on the way, is also taking some of the refugees. So, the Aquarius cannot head back to Libya for two reasons - it was plain lucky to get as far as Italy and it is at present stopped half way between Italy and Malta and in a bad state. Even if it could go back to Libya, it is only to the mafia controlling the port, so guess what will happen when it gets back? What I find risible about Americans like yourself is that when in was the SS Exodus carrying Jewish refugees intent upon going to Palestine, you guys were totally against all the ports that turned them away, but because these guys are Muslims, you're all totally against any port wanting to take them in. Enough said.Cheers Hughmac Nope.
Gotta call you out on this one.
Let's first start with this one:
- Quote:
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...."Let's see if I can explain this to you... Spain has an agreement with Morocco so that when illegal immigrants make it to Spain from Morocco, Spain flies them straight back and the Moroccan police are waiting for them when they land.
Keep paying attention..." .....
That will NEVER happen! Never. Niemals! Not a friggen chance in hell. I will make YOU a bet on that one. With me here? Over the next few weeks/months we'll watch what happens to THESE refugee's. OK? MY bet: They will DISAPPEAR into the night, armed with rucksack's, candy bars, flashlights and pointed toward the Pyrenees, not Morocco. Go! Off with you. Betcha! This is how the game is played by the liberal media: You quote such a law/agreement on the TV screen, interlaced with a photo of Morocco and then show an occasional "refugee plane" taking off from Barcelona, Madrid or wherever. "Hey, ...look! They're removing refugee's. See?" Liberals/socialists/commies, with the help of the 'far' left-wing media (read: BBC... ), lying through their teeth. Crappola of the first water. We've seen this act before.
Next, the idiots from the 'far' left-wing, who are supporting those boats leaving Libya, and supported by despicable characters like George Soros, could care less about the safety of those people and whether or not they make it to Sicily. They should all be shut down, right f'ing now! Human trafficking for political left-wing purposes. It is complete insanity.
Mozart
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Hughmac
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Jun 12 2018, 03:58 PM
Post #62
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- Harambe4Trump
- Jun 12 2018, 02:57 PM
- Hughmac
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- W A Mozart
- Jun 12 2018, 11:01 AM
And oh by the way, to really grasp the insanity here you need to look at this map, ...er, logistics....  Rather than bringing the 'migrants' back to Libya, which would be the SHORTEST route, the socialist/commie leader of Spain decided to welcome the new, and all, immigrants to Spain! "Hey, we'll leave the light on for you...!" They may even provide each and every one of them "a rucksack," some candy bars and a map, with a highlighted foot path over the Pyrenees. I am sure all of Spain is just thrilled, ... This is a perfect example as to how the 'far' left has destroyed Europe. Mozart
Right, reality check: Libya doesn't have a government; as a state it ceased to exist, thanks to the Brits and French taking out Gaddafi. There is nobody, therefore, in Libya that is going to receive them and keep them there. Let's see if I can explain this to you... Spain has an agreement with Morocco so that when illegal immigrants make it to Spain from Morocco, Spain flies them straight back and the Moroccan police are waiting for them when they land. Keep paying attention... Italy had such an agreement with Libya; i.e. Gaddafi, and it worked pretty well until France and the UK screwed it up. Now nobody in Libya is taking them back. Instead, it's the people-smuggling mafia that is running the coasts and ports. Are you getting an inkling of common sense running through the tortured caverns of you mind, my most excellent friend? Spain accepted those immigrants because by doing so it put the problem back into the EU's lap. OK, hold that thought. Now let's move onto the ship, Aquarius. It has 650 refugees onboard and it only has a carry capacity for just over a hundred. The ship cannot take a long journey in these conditions, not to mention the lack of supplies, water and you name it. Which is why Italy has now offered two ships to accompany the Aquarius to Valencia by sharing the passengers and providing the supplies. Corsica, which is on the way, is also taking some of the refugees. So, the Aquarius cannot head back to Libya for two reasons - it was plain lucky to get as far as Italy and it is at present stopped half way between Italy and Malta and in a bad state. Even if it could go back to Libya, it is only to the mafia controlling the port, so guess what will happen when it gets back? What I find risible about Americans like yourself is that when in was the SS Exodus carrying Jewish refugees intent upon going to Palestine, you guys were totally against all the ports that turned them away, but because these guys are Muslims, you're all totally against any port wanting to take them in. Enough said.Cheers Hughmac
America had no obligation to admit the SS Exodus and demonstrated moral clarity by refusing their entry then, something it lost before Trump’s election. They should have made a B-line to the Dominican Republic. Have you got absolutely no notion of Geography??? How the flying feck was the Exodus going to make it across the freakin Atlantic, H4T? The ship was specifically chosen because of its derelict condition. It was risky to put passengers on it and it was felt this would compel the British to let it pass blockade because of this danger.
Furthermore, the US did not refuse entry to SS Exodus, because it was never requested.
However after the creation of Israel the US took in 96,000 Jewish refugees under the Displaced Persons Programme - something that you personally would have railed against had you been around at the time.
Cheers HUghmac
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H4T wrote: [Global] nuclear annihilation is preferable to the pre-Trump immigration/refugee policies.
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Hughmac
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Jun 12 2018, 04:03 PM
Post #63
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- W A Mozart
- Jun 12 2018, 03:39 PM
- Hughmac
- Jun 12 2018, 02:45 PM
- W A Mozart
- Jun 12 2018, 11:01 AM
And oh by the way, to really grasp the insanity here you need to look at this map, ...er, logistics....  Rather than bringing the 'migrants' back to Libya, which would be the SHORTEST route, the socialist/commie leader of Spain decided to welcome the new, and all, immigrants to Spain! "Hey, we'll leave the light on for you...!" They may even provide each and every one of them "a rucksack," some candy bars and a map, with a highlighted foot path over the Pyrenees. I am sure all of Spain is just thrilled, ... This is a perfect example as to how the 'far' left has destroyed Europe. Mozart
Right, reality check: Libya doesn't have a government; as a state it ceased to exist, thanks to the Brits and French taking out Gaddafi. There is nobody, therefore, in Libya that is going to receive them and keep them there. Let's see if I can explain this to you... Spain has an agreement with Morocco so that when illegal immigrants make it to Spain from Morocco, Spain flies them straight back and the Moroccan police are waiting for them when they land. Keep paying attention... Italy had such an agreement with Libya; i.e. Gaddafi, and it worked pretty well until France and the UK screwed it up. Now nobody in Libya is taking them back. Instead, it's the people-smuggling mafia that is running the coasts and ports. Are you getting an inkling of common sense running through the tortured caverns of you mind, my most excellent friend? Spain accepted those immigrants because by doing so it put the problem back into the EU's lap. OK, hold that thought. Now let's move onto the ship, Aquarius. It has 650 refugees onboard and it only has a carry capacity for just over a hundred. The ship cannot take a long journey in these conditions, not to mention the lack of supplies, water and you name it. Which is why Italy has now offered two ships to accompany the Aquarius to Valencia by sharing the passengers and providing the supplies. Corsica, which is on the way, is also taking some of the refugees. So, the Aquarius cannot head back to Libya for two reasons - it was plain lucky to get as far as Italy and it is at present stopped half way between Italy and Malta and in a bad state. Even if it could go back to Libya, it is only to the mafia controlling the port, so guess what will happen when it gets back? What I find risible about Americans like yourself is that when in was the SS Exodus carrying Jewish refugees intent upon going to Palestine, you guys were totally against all the ports that turned them away, but because these guys are Muslims, you're all totally against any port wanting to take them in. Enough said.Cheers Hughmac
Nope. Gotta call you out on this one. Let's first start with this one: - Quote:
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...."Let's see if I can explain this to you... Spain has an agreement with Morocco so that when illegal immigrants make it to Spain from Morocco, Spain flies them straight back and the Moroccan police are waiting for them when they land.
Keep paying attention..." .....
That will NEVER happen! Never. Niemals! Not a friggen chance in hell. I will make YOU a bet on that one. With me here? Over the next few weeks/months we'll watch what happens to THESE refugee's. OK? MY bet: They will DISAPPEAR into the night, armed with rucksack's, candy bars, flashlights and pointed toward the Pyrenees, not Morocco. Go! Off with you. Betcha! This is how the game is played by the liberal media: You quote such a law/agreement on the TV screen, interlaced with a photo of Morocco and then show an occasional "refugee plane" taking off from Barcelona, Madrid or wherever. "Hey, ...look! They're removing refugee's. See?" Liberals/socialists/commies, with the help of the 'far' left-wing media (read: BBC...  ), lying through their teeth. Crappola of the first water. We've seen this act before. Next, the idiots from the 'far' left-wing, who are supporting those boats leaving Libya, and supported by despicable characters like George Soros, could care less about the safety of those people and whether or not they make it to Sicily. They should all be shut down, right f'ing now! Human trafficking for political left-wing purposes. It is complete insanity. Mozart Oh god! Why is it so uphill with you Mozzie - get some freaking coffee down you neck, for the love of God.
I informed you about a long-standing arrangement between Spain and Morocco to emphasise the fact that no such agreement now exists between Italy and Libya, which has pushed up the number of refugees arriving from Libya.
Got it now?
I was not saying that Spain will send these particular immigrants to Morocco. Where is your common sense? The arrangement is to return refugees that arrive from Morocco to Morocco. These refugees haven't come from Morocco; they have come from Libya.
Do get a grip!
Cheers Hughmac
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H4T wrote: [Global] nuclear annihilation is preferable to the pre-Trump immigration/refugee policies.
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Robert Stout
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Jun 12 2018, 05:13 PM
Post #64
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- Hughmac
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Quoting limited to 5 levels deep
America is absolutely a socialist nation - and is surviving despite that. Our ability to create 'wealth' out of thin air and use the military to maintain that hegemony is the reason I said that america is the best example of what you consider a balanced system. Looks can be deceiving however .... underneath there are big problems. http://www.usdebtclock.org/
I'm afraid that you don't create wealth out of thin air - your economy is buoyant only because of the petrol-dollar. The moment that countries start trading oil in Euros its all over for your economy. And there is no room for gloating because if the US economy goes down, the Western economy goes down, too. You invaded Iraq because Saddam had announced that he was going to sell oil in Euros. Trouble is, Iran will probably switched over after being screwed over by two-timing Trump under orders from Tel Aviv. In other words, if Europe sticks to the nuclear deal with Iran, despite the US going back on it, then Iran will probably trade Iranian oil in Euros, which suits the Europeans fine but will probably start an avalanche of other countries abandoning the petrol-dollar. Cheers Hughmac
Europe will be lucky if they can trade McDonald's BigMacs with their Euros after Trump is finished emasculating them....In five years, the Euro will not exist...........
Ah yes, the McDonald's BigMacs... the very pinnacle of American culinary skills, highlighting US cultural expression... H The golden arches are one of America's few cultural artifacts.............
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Jesus can raise the dead, but he can't fix stupid
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_g R_
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Jun 12 2018, 10:32 PM
Post #65
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. Italy had such an agreement with Libya; i.e. Gaddafi, and it worked pretty well until France and the UK screwed it up. Of course with the US right in the middle of it. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mlz3-OzcExI
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The real leftists are the silenced majority, the sleeping giant.
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Harambe4Trump
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Jun 12 2018, 11:56 PM
Post #66
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- Hughmac
- Jun 12 2018, 03:58 PM
- Harambe4Trump
- Jun 12 2018, 02:57 PM
- Hughmac
- Jun 12 2018, 02:45 PM
- W A Mozart
- Jun 12 2018, 11:01 AM
And oh by the way, to really grasp the insanity here you need to look at this map, ...er, logistics....  Rather than bringing the 'migrants' back to Libya, which would be the SHORTEST route, the socialist/commie leader of Spain decided to welcome the new, and all, immigrants to Spain! "Hey, we'll leave the light on for you...!" They may even provide each and every one of them "a rucksack," some candy bars and a map, with a highlighted foot path over the Pyrenees. I am sure all of Spain is just thrilled, ... This is a perfect example as to how the 'far' left has destroyed Europe. Mozart
Right, reality check: Libya doesn't have a government; as a state it ceased to exist, thanks to the Brits and French taking out Gaddafi. There is nobody, therefore, in Libya that is going to receive them and keep them there. Let's see if I can explain this to you... Spain has an agreement with Morocco so that when illegal immigrants make it to Spain from Morocco, Spain flies them straight back and the Moroccan police are waiting for them when they land. Keep paying attention... Italy had such an agreement with Libya; i.e. Gaddafi, and it worked pretty well until France and the UK screwed it up. Now nobody in Libya is taking them back. Instead, it's the people-smuggling mafia that is running the coasts and ports. Are you getting an inkling of common sense running through the tortured caverns of you mind, my most excellent friend? Spain accepted those immigrants because by doing so it put the problem back into the EU's lap. OK, hold that thought. Now let's move onto the ship, Aquarius. It has 650 refugees onboard and it only has a carry capacity for just over a hundred. The ship cannot take a long journey in these conditions, not to mention the lack of supplies, water and you name it. Which is why Italy has now offered two ships to accompany the Aquarius to Valencia by sharing the passengers and providing the supplies. Corsica, which is on the way, is also taking some of the refugees. So, the Aquarius cannot head back to Libya for two reasons - it was plain lucky to get as far as Italy and it is at present stopped half way between Italy and Malta and in a bad state. Even if it could go back to Libya, it is only to the mafia controlling the port, so guess what will happen when it gets back? What I find risible about Americans like yourself is that when in was the SS Exodus carrying Jewish refugees intent upon going to Palestine, you guys were totally against all the ports that turned them away, but because these guys are Muslims, you're all totally against any port wanting to take them in. Enough said.Cheers Hughmac
America had no obligation to admit the SS Exodus and demonstrated moral clarity by refusing their entry then, something it lost before Trump’s election. They should have made a B-line to the Dominican Republic.
Have you got absolutely no notion of Geography??? How the flying feck was the Exodus going to make it across the freakin Atlantic, H4T? The ship was specifically chosen because of its derelict condition. It was risky to put passengers on it and it was felt this would compel the British to let it pass blockade because of this danger. Furthermore, the US did not refuse entry to SS Exodus, because it was never requested. However after the creation of Israel the US took in 96,000 Jewish refugees under the Displaced Persons Programme - something that you personally would have railed against had you been around at the time. Cheers HUghmac Yes, I’m consistent in that. Immigration should have come to an end at 1776. It corrodes a nation
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Skipping leg day is the equivalent of a woman having an abortion. You're ashamed of it, and it was probably unnecessary. #MAGA #wallsnotwars
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ringotuna
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Jun 13 2018, 04:18 AM
Post #67
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Hughmac. I should be embarrassed to share this with you but I simply must.
Between 1999 & 2005 I was a partner in a small but growing seed business. Sometime around 2003 we received a visit from a group of Spanish agri-businessmen interested in importing and marketing our certified non-GMO products into Spain and the EU. It took less than half an hour into our business luncheon for everyone at the table to realize that one of my partners did not know the difference between Spain and Mexico. The elder partner and I were red faced with embarrassment.
Ouch! To be fair, the meeting was taking place in the USA; had it been in Spain there would have been no confusion on his part... hopefully. What was the Spaniards' English like, by the way? Cheers Hughmac Hopefully he would not have mistaken the Atlantic Ocean for the Rio Grande. Their English was passable, much better than my Spanish.
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Ringoism: Never underestimate the advantages of being underestimated.
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Hughmac
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Jun 13 2018, 06:05 AM
Post #68
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- Harambe4Trump
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Yes, I’m consistent in that. Immigration should have come to an end at 1776. It corrodes a nation I see. So it doesn't bother you that George Washington, John Adams, Thomas Jefferson, James Madison, James Monroe, John Q. Adams, Andrew Jackson, and William Henry Harrison were all born British - foreigners, sort of thing?
So, you would have no Herbert Hoover, James Buchanan (1857-1861) and Chester Arthur (1881-1885), both of whom had Irish fathers, and Woodrow Wilson (1913-1921) who had an English mother.
Donald Trump's mother was a Scottish immigrant and his grandfather emigrated from Germany in 1885, so no Trump - Oops!
Ronald Wilson Reagan? Nope! Two of his grandparents were from England and virtually all of his great grandparents were from Ireland and all born around the 1820s. So, no Ronny!
General Douglas MacArthur? Nope, he's out as his paternal grandfather was born in Glasgow, Scotland.
Need I really go on to demonstrate how radically ridiculous your "no immigrants after 1776" is. Furthermore, I doubt that you can personally trace all of your relatives born post 1776 to solely American roots, which means you'd better get your passport sorted out, too.
Cheers Hughmac
Edited by Hughmac, Jun 13 2018, 06:10 AM.
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H4T wrote: [Global] nuclear annihilation is preferable to the pre-Trump immigration/refugee policies.
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Hughmac
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Jun 13 2018, 06:32 AM
Post #69
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...And it goes on; Henry Ford's father; William was born in 1826 in County Cork, Ireland - Oops!
The Wright Brothers? Their Grandfather was John Gottlieb Koerner who was born in Germany in 1791 - Out he goes - Oops!
Oh, oh, wait! What about your personal hero, Charles Augustus Lindbergh? Nope, sorry Charlie because H4T says you ain't 'Merican cuz your daddy was born in Stockholm, Sweden! Now, ain't that an Oops!
I say! This is fun!
Cheers Hughmac
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H4T wrote: [Global] nuclear annihilation is preferable to the pre-Trump immigration/refugee policies.
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ringotuna
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Jun 13 2018, 06:35 AM
Post #70
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Not to mention my paternal ancestors who arrived here from Southern England in the early 1800's
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Ringoism: Never underestimate the advantages of being underestimated.
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Hughmac
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Jun 13 2018, 07:12 AM
Post #71
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- ringotuna
- Jun 13 2018, 06:35 AM
Not to mention my paternal ancestors who arrived here from Southern England in the early 1800's Any man whose parents were born in Southern (God's Country) England should erect a plaque in honour of their majestic roots!
Furthermore, if you tell me they were born in Wiltshire then... All hail King Ringotuna!
Cheers Hughmac
Edited by Hughmac, Jun 13 2018, 07:12 AM.
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H4T wrote: [Global] nuclear annihilation is preferable to the pre-Trump immigration/refugee policies.
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estonianman
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Jun 13 2018, 07:21 AM
Post #72
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- estonianman
- Jun 3 2018, 11:36 AM
The problem lies in the incentives for success being lost when you nibble away at the meritocracy. Marxists/socialists incorrectly think that people want to work, but the reality is people just want a means to get "stuff". If that means they can modify their behaviour to get a government benefit, they will do it. I see bonafide republicans who REEEEEEEEE about welfare brats all day long while their wife is on SS disability because of a back problem 20 years ago - ALL THE TIME in red states. Hence the "gibs me dat" entitled class grows which is why a mixed economy is ultimately unsustainable, especially in a democracy. Europe is expediting this process of cascading failure by putting socialists in seats of power while importing millions of economic migrants.
I agree with this completely. Many people don't want to work. There are cases of three generations of welfare-benefit receivers living under one roof. Some people are claiming benefits because 'they cannot work' they claim, but if the gravy train passed by without stopping, they would soon find that they are miraculously fit for work again when they start to get hungry. Others genuinely cannot work, amongst whom was my wife, who after her first brain-tumour operation had virtually zero short-term memory and no peripheral vision. She had worked all her life (and she was damned hard worker), paid her taxes and received a disability allowance for the remaining four years of her life. Thanks to National Public Health all her brain operations during that time - she had about seven - were possible, and it didn't cost us a penny more that what we had been paying through our taxes. She had the best possible treatment under Spain's top neurosurgeon, who was, fortunately for us, based in Granada's main hospital. In the US, we would have had to sell everything we owned and borrowed off friend and family to have been able to afford what we had in Spain, yet you quote the US as the country with the best balance between capitalism and socialism? Look, even in the armed forces (the right-wing's darling), is the essence of socialism in the sense of the state providing for the common good, yet there is waste and slacking off. I remember when somebody had stolen the laces from my shoes, so I went to the stores for new laces, which would have been docked from my salary, but the clerk just handed me new shoes complete with laces, because it was easier and less paperwork, which I wouldn't be docked for. Anybody who has done time in the forces knows that waste there is prolific. Cheers Hughmac PS: You're going to have to wait for my next post, I'm afraid as this one is already my 3rd one, so I will have to wait for somebody else to post on this thread - sorry!
America is absolutely a socialist nation - and is surviving despite that. Our ability to create 'wealth' out of thin air and use the military to maintain that hegemony is the reason I said that america is the best example of what you consider a balanced system. Looks can be deceiving however .... underneath there are big problems. http://www.usdebtclock.org/
I'm afraid that you don't create wealth out of thin air - your economy is buoyant only because of the petrol-dollar. The moment that countries start trading oil in Euros its all over for your economy. And there is no room for gloating because if the US economy goes down, the Western economy goes down, too. You invaded Iraq because Saddam had announced that he was going to sell oil in Euros. Trouble is, Iran will probably switched over after being screwed over by two-timing Trump under orders from Tel Aviv. In other words, if Europe sticks to the nuclear deal with Iran, despite the US going back on it, then Iran will probably trade Iranian oil in Euros, which suits the Europeans fine but will probably start an avalanche of other countries abandoning the petrol-dollar. Cheers Hughmac Backed on the petro-dollar, which requires ongoing diplomatic and military efforts - you are absolutely correct in that sense no it isn't "thin air". I was referring to the traditional sense, that a resource wasn't hoarded and currency was issued on that.
A good thought exercise, does the state and defense department budget exceed the amount of USD created in a given year. I don't know the answer - legitimately asking.
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MEEK AND MILD
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Hughmac
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Jun 13 2018, 07:57 AM
Post #73
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- estonianman
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- Jun 3 2018, 11:36 AM
The problem lies in the incentives for success being lost when you nibble away at the meritocracy. Marxists/socialists incorrectly think that people want to work, but the reality is people just want a means to get "stuff". If that means they can modify their behaviour to get a government benefit, they will do it. I see bonafide republicans who REEEEEEEEE about welfare brats all day long while their wife is on SS disability because of a back problem 20 years ago - ALL THE TIME in red states. Hence the "gibs me dat" entitled class grows which is why a mixed economy is ultimately unsustainable, especially in a democracy. Europe is expediting this process of cascading failure by putting socialists in seats of power while importing millions of economic migrants.
I agree with this completely. Many people don't want to work. There are cases of three generations of welfare-benefit receivers living under one roof. Some people are claiming benefits because 'they cannot work' they claim, but if the gravy train passed by without stopping, they would soon find that they are miraculously fit for work again when they start to get hungry. Others genuinely cannot work, amongst whom was my wife, who after her first brain-tumour operation had virtually zero short-term memory and no peripheral vision. She had worked all her life (and she was damned hard worker), paid her taxes and received a disability allowance for the remaining four years of her life. Thanks to National Public Health all her brain operations during that time - she had about seven - were possible, and it didn't cost us a penny more that what we had been paying through our taxes. She had the best possible treatment under Spain's top neurosurgeon, who was, fortunately for us, based in Granada's main hospital. In the US, we would have had to sell everything we owned and borrowed off friend and family to have been able to afford what we had in Spain, yet you quote the US as the country with the best balance between capitalism and socialism? Look, even in the armed forces (the right-wing's darling), is the essence of socialism in the sense of the state providing for the common good, yet there is waste and slacking off. I remember when somebody had stolen the laces from my shoes, so I went to the stores for new laces, which would have been docked from my salary, but the clerk just handed me new shoes complete with laces, because it was easier and less paperwork, which I wouldn't be docked for. Anybody who has done time in the forces knows that waste there is prolific. Cheers Hughmac PS: You're going to have to wait for my next post, I'm afraid as this one is already my 3rd one, so I will have to wait for somebody else to post on this thread - sorry!
America is absolutely a socialist nation - and is surviving despite that. Our ability to create 'wealth' out of thin air and use the military to maintain that hegemony is the reason I said that america is the best example of what you consider a balanced system. Looks can be deceiving however .... underneath there are big problems. http://www.usdebtclock.org/
I'm afraid that you don't create wealth out of thin air - your economy is buoyant only because of the petrol-dollar. The moment that countries start trading oil in Euros its all over for your economy. And there is no room for gloating because if the US economy goes down, the Western economy goes down, too. You invaded Iraq because Saddam had announced that he was going to sell oil in Euros. Trouble is, Iran will probably switched over after being screwed over by two-timing Trump under orders from Tel Aviv. In other words, if Europe sticks to the nuclear deal with Iran, despite the US going back on it, then Iran will probably trade Iranian oil in Euros, which suits the Europeans fine but will probably start an avalanche of other countries abandoning the petrol-dollar. Cheers Hughmac
Backed on the petro-dollar, which requires ongoing diplomatic and military efforts - you are absolutely correct in that sense no it isn't "thin air". I was referring to the traditional sense, that a resource wasn't hoarded and currency was issued on that. A good thought exercise, does the state and defense department budget exceed the amount of USD created in a given year. I don't know the answer - legitimately asking. The US has a tremendous wealth generation capacity thanks to a resource-rich economy - no arguments. But a huge part of the economy depends on a fiat currency, which thanks to Q.E. has been gutted (the same is true in the rest of the West's currencies).
Nobody in the West would survive the US economy going down, except China, perhaps, who would gain from it. One thing is for sure, before the US tanks, it will go to war, as the economy thrives on a war-driven industry.
For the above reason, if the US, suckered by Israel, pushes Iran into trading in Euros, there will be a war; one which will ruin everybody except China and it will have nothing to do with Iran military capacity.
Your question is a very interesting one and one for which I don't know the answer - sorry. Hopefully another poster can supply the answer .
Cheers Hughmac
Edited by Hughmac, Jun 13 2018, 07:59 AM.
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H4T wrote: [Global] nuclear annihilation is preferable to the pre-Trump immigration/refugee policies.
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W A Mozart
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Jun 13 2018, 09:31 AM
Post #74
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- Hughmac
- Jun 12 2018, 04:03 PM
- W A Mozart
- Jun 12 2018, 03:39 PM
- Hughmac
- Jun 12 2018, 02:45 PM
- W A Mozart
- Jun 12 2018, 11:01 AM
And oh by the way, to really grasp the insanity here you need to look at this map, ...er, logistics....  Rather than bringing the 'migrants' back to Libya, which would be the SHORTEST route, the socialist/commie leader of Spain decided to welcome the new, and all, immigrants to Spain! "Hey, we'll leave the light on for you...!" They may even provide each and every one of them "a rucksack," some candy bars and a map, with a highlighted foot path over the Pyrenees. I am sure all of Spain is just thrilled, ... This is a perfect example as to how the 'far' left has destroyed Europe. Mozart
Right, reality check: Libya doesn't have a government; as a state it ceased to exist, thanks to the Brits and French taking out Gaddafi. There is nobody, therefore, in Libya that is going to receive them and keep them there. Let's see if I can explain this to you... Spain has an agreement with Morocco so that when illegal immigrants make it to Spain from Morocco, Spain flies them straight back and the Moroccan police are waiting for them when they land. Keep paying attention... Italy had such an agreement with Libya; i.e. Gaddafi, and it worked pretty well until France and the UK screwed it up. Now nobody in Libya is taking them back. Instead, it's the people-smuggling mafia that is running the coasts and ports. Are you getting an inkling of common sense running through the tortured caverns of you mind, my most excellent friend? Spain accepted those immigrants because by doing so it put the problem back into the EU's lap. OK, hold that thought. Now let's move onto the ship, Aquarius. It has 650 refugees onboard and it only has a carry capacity for just over a hundred. The ship cannot take a long journey in these conditions, not to mention the lack of supplies, water and you name it. Which is why Italy has now offered two ships to accompany the Aquarius to Valencia by sharing the passengers and providing the supplies. Corsica, which is on the way, is also taking some of the refugees. So, the Aquarius cannot head back to Libya for two reasons - it was plain lucky to get as far as Italy and it is at present stopped half way between Italy and Malta and in a bad state. Even if it could go back to Libya, it is only to the mafia controlling the port, so guess what will happen when it gets back? What I find risible about Americans like yourself is that when in was the SS Exodus carrying Jewish refugees intent upon going to Palestine, you guys were totally against all the ports that turned them away, but because these guys are Muslims, you're all totally against any port wanting to take them in. Enough said.Cheers Hughmac
Nope. Gotta call you out on this one. Let's first start with this one: - Quote:
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...."Let's see if I can explain this to you... Spain has an agreement with Morocco so that when illegal immigrants make it to Spain from Morocco, Spain flies them straight back and the Moroccan police are waiting for them when they land.
Keep paying attention..." .....
That will NEVER happen! Never. Niemals! Not a friggen chance in hell. I will make YOU a bet on that one. With me here? Over the next few weeks/months we'll watch what happens to THESE refugee's. OK? MY bet: They will DISAPPEAR into the night, armed with rucksack's, candy bars, flashlights and pointed toward the Pyrenees, not Morocco. Go! Off with you. Betcha! This is how the game is played by the liberal media: You quote such a law/agreement on the TV screen, interlaced with a photo of Morocco and then show an occasional "refugee plane" taking off from Barcelona, Madrid or wherever. "Hey, ...look! They're removing refugee's. See?" Liberals/socialists/commies, with the help of the 'far' left-wing media (read: BBC...  ), lying through their teeth. Crappola of the first water. We've seen this act before. Next, the idiots from the 'far' left-wing, who are supporting those boats leaving Libya, and supported by despicable characters like George Soros, could care less about the safety of those people and whether or not they make it to Sicily. They should all be shut down, right f'ing now! Human trafficking for political left-wing purposes. It is complete insanity. Mozart
Oh god! Why is it so uphill with you Mozzie - get some freaking coffee down you neck, for the love of God. I informed you about a long-standing arrangement between Spain and Morocco to emphasise the fact that no such agreement now exists between Italy and Libya, which has pushed up the number of refugees arriving from Libya. Got it now? I was not saying that Spain will send these particular immigrants to Morocco. Where is your common sense? The arrangement is to return refugees that arrive from Morocco to Morocco. These refugees haven't come from Morocco; they have come from Libya. Do get a grip! Cheers Hughmac Ah, ....! Morning coffee with a hard-boiled egg! Now you're in trouble.
I'll discuss this a little bit later on today as I can only make a brief comment right now.
First, this is the BIGGEST story in Europe today, and perhaps in the last 10 years. The Italians are screaming mad, and there is a new conservative government in place that is shaking the very foundation of the EU. Hurrah! Shake baby, shake! Big stuff here.
Second, let's look at the statement you made BEFORE I placed that quote for my observation, shall we?
..."Right, reality check: Libya doesn't have a government; as a state it ceased to exist, thanks to the Brits and French taking out Gaddafi. There is nobody, therefore, in Libya that is going to receive them and keep them there." ...
So, "there is nobody, therefore, in Libya that is going to receive them and keep them there." Right. Got it.
Which led to the VERY next sentence, ....
- Quote:
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...."Let's see if I can explain this to you... Spain has an agreement with Morocco so that when illegal immigrants make it to Spain from Morocco, Spain flies them straight back and the Moroccan police are waiting for them when they land.
Keep paying attention..." .....
See the confusion here?
How can one point to the so-called "agreement" between Spain and Morocco after pointing to, in the previous sentence, the so-called "dilemma" of the new socialist/commie Prime Minister of Spain as to whether or not accept this boatload of refugee's? The obvious idea here being, "don't worry, we're gonna send em all back anyway."
The real point here is the utter insanity of the new socialist/commie Prime Minister, Sanchez. It didn't take him a couple of weeks before he shocked the nation of Spain. YOU can't tell me that this, ...THIS is the talk of all Spaniards behind closed doors, ...right now, today. Spain is in shock. They've just had their idiot Prime Minister mark Spain as being a "welcome way station" for ALL migrants in the world. "Hey, come to Spain! We'll keep the light on for ya...!" Complete and utter insanity. But what does one expect from a commie? That's my point.
The hard-boiled egg was delicious, thank you very much, ....
Mozart
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Hughmac
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Jun 13 2018, 10:18 AM
Post #75
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- W A Mozart
- Jun 13 2018, 09:31 AM
- Hughmac
- Jun 12 2018, 04:03 PM
- W A Mozart
- Jun 12 2018, 03:39 PM
- Hughmac
- Jun 12 2018, 02:45 PM
- W A Mozart
- Jun 12 2018, 11:01 AM
And oh by the way, to really grasp the insanity here you need to look at this map, ...er, logistics....  Rather than bringing the 'migrants' back to Libya, which would be the SHORTEST route, the socialist/commie leader of Spain decided to welcome the new, and all, immigrants to Spain! "Hey, we'll leave the light on for you...!" They may even provide each and every one of them "a rucksack," some candy bars and a map, with a highlighted foot path over the Pyrenees. I am sure all of Spain is just thrilled, ... This is a perfect example as to how the 'far' left has destroyed Europe. Mozart
Right, reality check: Libya doesn't have a government; as a state it ceased to exist, thanks to the Brits and French taking out Gaddafi. There is nobody, therefore, in Libya that is going to receive them and keep them there. Let's see if I can explain this to you... Spain has an agreement with Morocco so that when illegal immigrants make it to Spain from Morocco, Spain flies them straight back and the Moroccan police are waiting for them when they land. Keep paying attention... Italy had such an agreement with Libya; i.e. Gaddafi, and it worked pretty well until France and the UK screwed it up. Now nobody in Libya is taking them back. Instead, it's the people-smuggling mafia that is running the coasts and ports. Are you getting an inkling of common sense running through the tortured caverns of you mind, my most excellent friend? Spain accepted those immigrants because by doing so it put the problem back into the EU's lap. OK, hold that thought. Now let's move onto the ship, Aquarius. It has 650 refugees onboard and it only has a carry capacity for just over a hundred. The ship cannot take a long journey in these conditions, not to mention the lack of supplies, water and you name it. Which is why Italy has now offered two ships to accompany the Aquarius to Valencia by sharing the passengers and providing the supplies. Corsica, which is on the way, is also taking some of the refugees. So, the Aquarius cannot head back to Libya for two reasons - it was plain lucky to get as far as Italy and it is at present stopped half way between Italy and Malta and in a bad state. Even if it could go back to Libya, it is only to the mafia controlling the port, so guess what will happen when it gets back? What I find risible about Americans like yourself is that when in was the SS Exodus carrying Jewish refugees intent upon going to Palestine, you guys were totally against all the ports that turned them away, but because these guys are Muslims, you're all totally against any port wanting to take them in. Enough said.Cheers Hughmac
Nope. Gotta call you out on this one. Let's first start with this one: - Quote:
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...."Let's see if I can explain this to you... Spain has an agreement with Morocco so that when illegal immigrants make it to Spain from Morocco, Spain flies them straight back and the Moroccan police are waiting for them when they land.
Keep paying attention..." .....
That will NEVER happen! Never. Niemals! Not a friggen chance in hell. I will make YOU a bet on that one. With me here? Over the next few weeks/months we'll watch what happens to THESE refugee's. OK? MY bet: They will DISAPPEAR into the night, armed with rucksack's, candy bars, flashlights and pointed toward the Pyrenees, not Morocco. Go! Off with you. Betcha! This is how the game is played by the liberal media: You quote such a law/agreement on the TV screen, interlaced with a photo of Morocco and then show an occasional "refugee plane" taking off from Barcelona, Madrid or wherever. "Hey, ...look! They're removing refugee's. See?" Liberals/socialists/commies, with the help of the 'far' left-wing media (read: BBC...  ), lying through their teeth. Crappola of the first water. We've seen this act before. Next, the idiots from the 'far' left-wing, who are supporting those boats leaving Libya, and supported by despicable characters like George Soros, could care less about the safety of those people and whether or not they make it to Sicily. They should all be shut down, right f'ing now! Human trafficking for political left-wing purposes. It is complete insanity. Mozart
Oh god! Why is it so uphill with you Mozzie - get some freaking coffee down you neck, for the love of God. I informed you about a long-standing arrangement between Spain and Morocco to emphasise the fact that no such agreement now exists between Italy and Libya, which has pushed up the number of refugees arriving from Libya. Got it now? I was not saying that Spain will send these particular immigrants to Morocco. Where is your common sense? The arrangement is to return refugees that arrive from Morocco to Morocco. These refugees haven't come from Morocco; they have come from Libya. Do get a grip! Cheers Hughmac
Ah, ....! Morning coffee with a hard-boiled egg! Now you're in trouble. I'll discuss this a little bit later on today as I can only make a brief comment right now. First, this is the BIGGEST story in Europe today, and perhaps in the last 10 years. The Italians are screaming mad, and there is a new conservative government in place that is shaking the very foundation of the EU. Hurrah! Shake baby, shake! Big stuff here. Second, let's look at the statement you made BEFORE I placed that quote for my observation, shall we? ..."Right, reality check: Libya doesn't have a government; as a state it ceased to exist, thanks to the Brits and French taking out Gaddafi. There is nobody, therefore, in Libya that is going to receive them and keep them there." ... So, "there is nobody, therefore, in Libya that is going to receive them and keep them there." Right. Got it. Which led to the VERY next sentence, .... - Quote:
-
...."Let's see if I can explain this to you... Spain has an agreement with Morocco so that when illegal immigrants make it to Spain from Morocco, Spain flies them straight back and the Moroccan police are waiting for them when they land.
Keep paying attention..." .....
See the confusion here? How can one point to the so-called "agreement" between Spain and Morocco after pointing to, in the previous sentence, the so-called "dilemma" of the new socialist/commie Prime Minister of Spain as to whether or not accept this boatload of refugee's? The obvious idea here being, "don't worry, we're gonna send em all back anyway." The real point here is the utter insanity of the new socialist/commie Prime Minister, Sanchez. It didn't take him a couple of weeks before he shocked the nation of Spain. YOU can't tell me that this, ...THIS is the talk of all Spaniards behind closed doors, ...right now, today. Spain is in shock. They've just had their idiot Prime Minister mark Spain as being a "welcome way station" for ALL migrants in the world. "Hey, come to Spain! We'll keep the light on for ya...!" Complete and utter insanity. But what does one expect from a commie? That's my point. The hard-boiled egg was delicious, thank you very much, .... Mozart Your confusion has me flummoxed. You do know the difference between Libya and Morocco, I am sure, but perhaps you have some confusion over Spanish extended geography. Spain has two North African enclave cities: Melilla and Ceuta. Illegal immigrants jump the fence and if they are adults, they're sent back. Spain also has the Canary Islands, just off the West Coast of Africa, which receives illegal immigrants, mostly from Morocco, too.
Which brings us to the sea and maritime law concerning assistance in distress. Now all your cuddly KKK compatriots and their watered down but persistent likeminded critters just go on barking about Aquarius.
This ship was six times over its passenger-carrying capacity, little or no food & water supplies or fuel, with 120 children and 7 pregnant women on board, who were denied safe port. They requested immediate assistance, which Spain responded to. Italy, once Spain had said that they could land in Valencia, and knowing that the ship could not reach Spain under its own steam, supplied two supply & escort boats that would spread the passengers between them.
Got it?
it's got nothing to do with being socialist (one of your obsessions) and has everything to do with maritime law and humanitarian aid.
Long before this refugee crisis began, it has been the policy of Spanish governments (both conservative an socialists) to process and return illegal immigrants to Morocco, with whom we have an agreement. This is the case if they make the beaches, jump the fence (Ceuta/Melilla) or arrived as stowaway under lorries on the North African ferries. if they are adults, they are returned almost immediately. The exceptions are minors and pregnant women.
When the Coastguards come across crowded zodiac dinghies, or any kind of open boat, the passengers, who are often suffering from exposure (winter) or sunstroke (summer), are transferred onto the patrol ships and taken to port for processing. What you don't do, is leave them out there - the Mediterranean is already a watery mass-grave. These, again are processed and returned.
Now - and here I appeal to your waning sense of Geography - illegal immigrants that did not come via Morocco cannot be returned via Morocco - that is how the agreement works. Got it, Mozzie? Nobody was ever saying that these immigrants could be handed over to Morocco.
The reason that I mentioned the Spanish-Moroccan Immigrant-Return Agreement was that such an accord existed between Italy and Libya, which worked for them as it our one with Morocco works for us.
But, of course, London and Paris turned Libya into government-less, lawless state so there is nobody slowing the flow to Italy and Italy has taken as much of it as it can stand. Greece, Italy and Spain are the three states that are taking the brunt of immigration problem and Italy has taken a stand to force the EU to provide a combined, effective response and solution.
With these particular immigrants there has been a wave of solidarity in Spain and indeed over Western Europe - I don't include your Eastern European buddies, which have little history of Western-style democracy. I would be very surprised under this glare of public awareness if most of them were returned, especially the minors and pregnant women.
I do sincerely hope that this has both cleared up your confusion and been informative for you.
Cheers Hughmac
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H4T wrote: [Global] nuclear annihilation is preferable to the pre-Trump immigration/refugee policies.
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W A Mozart
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Jun 13 2018, 12:26 PM
Post #76
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A few comments here....(I won't copy that long, long trailer above, .... )
First, I want you to look at this:

Since we're going back and forth on geography, let me show you where Tunisia lies. See it? Right there, below Sicily. It's where Monty drove Rommel off the African continent. You should know the place, ...(!), being a military guy and all that. ...
So, like, why aren't they sending these people to Tunisia instead, ...1 day's travel, instead of 6 to Valencia? Hmmm?
Second, this quote:
...."With these particular immigrants there has been a wave of solidarity in Spain and indeed over Western Europe..." ...
Er, sez who? What poll are you looking at? There is no "solidarity" among the people of Spain, especially those living in Italy or France. Europe is being run-amok with migrants and you see, "solidarity?" What is happening in Europe today is nothing short of an awakening. People are furious all over the place. Don't believe me? Look at the Italian elections. Look at Slovenia. Look at my beloved Austria. And, and, look what's gonna happen in Sweden in September. That's my proof, ....what's yours?
Mozart
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Hughmac
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Jun 13 2018, 01:00 PM
Post #77
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- W A Mozart
- Jun 13 2018, 12:26 PM
A few comments here....(I won't copy that long, long trailer above, ....  ) First, I want you to look at this:  Since we're going back and forth on geography, let me show you where Tunisia lies. See it? Right there, below Sicily. It's where Monty drove Rommel off the African continent. You should know the place, ...(!), being a military guy and all that. ... So, like, why aren't they sending these people to Tunisia instead, ...1 day's travel, instead of 6 to Valencia? Hmmm? Second, this quote: ...."With these particular immigrants there has been a wave of solidarity in Spain and indeed over Western Europe..." ... Er, sez who? What poll are you looking at? There is no "solidarity" among the people of Spain, especially those living in Italy or France. Europe is being run-amok with migrants and you see, "solidarity?" What is happening in Europe today is nothing short of an awakening. People are furious all over the place. Don't believe me? Look at the Italian elections. Look at Slovenia. Look at my beloved Austria. And, and, look what's gonna happen in Sweden in September. That's my proof, ....what's yours? Mozart Firstly, thank you for cutting down on the quoting - good idea.
Yes, I know where Tunisia is, Mozzie, and I can also tell you that in the 1950s it had a more advanced Constitution than that of Spain; i.e., I am not void of knowledge on the said country. You might also remember that the Kasserine Pass is in Tunisia, where your ill-prepared and ridiculously optimistic army was dicked during WW2 - ring a bell?
You can't just take immigrants and bundle them into somebody else's port without their permission, Mozzie - I would have thought that you had known that.
Here, let me help you out: illegal immigrants under their own steam are entering a country illegally. If you take the immigrants into another country without that country's permission, then you are People Smuggling and liable to a long prison sentence.
Tunisia’s border with Libya is a pretty dangerous place. You will remember the country is slowly recovering from having thrown off their dictator during the Arab Spring days in 2011 and certainly is not in a state stable enough to cope with refugees. They have also heavily been hit by terrorism with attacks against foreign tourists, aimed at ruining the rickety economy.
You appear to be unaware of the fact that the Aquarius belongs to a NGO, who rescued the immigrants on the high seas and were heading for the nearest port, which was in Italy, as they had always done, which was when the goose-stepping foreign minister, belonging to the Liga Norte, said, "You can't land in an Italian port."
So, with little food and supplies, then headed for nearby Malta but got a negative before they got their thus stranding the rescue ship out to sea with nowhere to go, little fuel and dangerously overcrowded. The skipper, after all, had set off on a day's patrol with enough supplies for the trip only, expecting to return to his Italian port that same day.
Now, I trust, the true dimensions of the situation is belatedly dawning on you.
Please free to make more illogical and uninformed (about the situation) suggestion and I will be only too happy to come to your aid.
Oh, before I go, I am troubled by this illogical statement from you: "There is no "solidarity" among the people of Spain, especially those living in Italy or France." I wasn't aware that Spanish expats in those two countries had strong feelings on this affair. As for Spaniards here in Spain, yes there is a certain pride that Spain stepped up to the plate on this one. The only people less than happy is the ousted PP party, who are smitten with an extraordinary amount of butt-hurt.
Cheers Hughmac
Edited by Hughmac, Jun 13 2018, 01:09 PM.
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H4T wrote: [Global] nuclear annihilation is preferable to the pre-Trump immigration/refugee policies.
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Robert Stout
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Jun 13 2018, 03:37 PM
Post #78
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I suspect that Spaniards will quickly tire of Refugees....This incident may be an isolated instance of bad judgment.........
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Jesus can raise the dead, but he can't fix stupid
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W A Mozart
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Jun 15 2018, 10:29 AM
Post #79
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...."Spain’s socialist government wants to remove barbed wire from border between Europe and Africa." ... https://voiceofeurope.com/2018/06/spains-socialist-government-wants-to-remove-barbed-wire-from-border-between-europe-and-africa/
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Spain’s new interior minister pledged to do his best to reduce migrants’ injuries by removing barbed wire sections from the border between Europe and Africa. With Ceuta and Melilla, Spain has two land borders on the African continent.
Even though the 20-foot fences are often easily crossed by climbing migrants, apparently, they won’t be enhanced but rather weakened by the new socialist Spanish Government.
“I will do everything possible so that the barbed wire at the borders of Ceuta and Mellila with Morocco are removed (…) it is a priority”, said Interior Minister Fernando Grande-Marlaska to radio station COPE.

Right.
Perhaps we should suggest to the NEW Spanish Interior Minister, Mr. Fernando Grande-Marlaska, .... , that he provide ladders to all of the would-be migrants trying to enter Spain? I just noticed that Walmart is having a sale on them next week. Save money, and all that.
Aren't those socialists/commies, ....special?
....
Mozart
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Hughmac
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Jun 15 2018, 02:39 PM
Post #80
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- W A Mozart
- Jun 15 2018, 10:29 AM
...."Spain’s socialist government wants to remove barbed wire from border between Europe and Africa." ...https://voiceofeurope.com/2018/06/spains-socialist-government-wants-to-remove-barbed-wire-from-border-between-europe-and-africa/- Quote:
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Spain’s new interior minister pledged to do his best to reduce migrants’ injuries by removing barbed wire sections from the border between Europe and Africa. With Ceuta and Melilla, Spain has two land borders on the African continent.
Even though the 20-foot fences are often easily crossed by climbing migrants, apparently, they won’t be enhanced but rather weakened by the new socialist Spanish Government.
“I will do everything possible so that the barbed wire at the borders of Ceuta and Mellila with Morocco are removed (…) it is a priority”, said Interior Minister Fernando Grande-Marlaska to radio station COPE.
 Right. Perhaps we should suggest to the NEW Spanish Interior Minister, Mr. Fernando Grande-Marlaska, ....  , that he provide ladders to all of the would-be migrants trying to enter Spain? I just noticed that Walmart is having a sale on them next week. Save money, and all that. Aren't those socialists/commies, ....special? .... Mozart Riiiiigghhhht! So have been shot down in a shower of s**t over the Aquarius and the Tommy Robinson, you've now gone for the "Barbed wired." ...And put your foot in it yet again. You see, it's not barbed wire but razor wire along the top of the fence. You do know the difference between barbed wire and razor wire, right?
Let's see, it was a socialist government under Zapatero who originally decided on topping the 6 to 9m high fence with razor wire but after receiving strong criticism from other political parties, (amongst other the PP conservatives) and humanitarian organisations, as well as the EU, he decided to take it down about two years later. Then the PP, after having criticised the socialist for using it, decided to put it up again once they got into office. As with the first time, Spain received widespread condemnation especially after one immigrant bled to death from his wounds.
So, the new socialist government want to do away with the razor-wire that lines the top of the fence and replace it with another measure, more humane.
Of course, your howling, drama queen post doesn't even go there, does it - no, it just says that the "commies" are taking down the wire" as if they were dismantling the whole damned fence, but what do you expect from a rabid-right voiceofeurope site?
So what's plan B, Mozzie? find something else on your sicko-sites that is complete bollocks or at the very least, deliberately leave out facts that put an entirely different light on a subject?
Despite this unrelenting, idiotic quasi-hate-filled content of your latest posts, I, as always, wish you a pleasant weekend with you family and friends
Cheers Hughmac
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H4T wrote: [Global] nuclear annihilation is preferable to the pre-Trump immigration/refugee policies.
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