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Single payer healthcare
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Topic Started: Apr 11 2016, 11:21 AM (1,099 Views)
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estonianman
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Apr 12 2016, 11:31 PM
Post #21
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- BuckFan
- Apr 12 2016, 11:20 PM
- estonianman
- Apr 12 2016, 06:56 PM
So we compare costs 150 years ago and conclude that prices have gone up. Who wudda guessed? So the solution is to go back to fraternal organizations providing health insurance ... got it. Technology should increase productivity, and thereby decrease prices.
No?
We agree healthcare is obviously fecked now - it might provide some value to look at a time when it wasn't fecked, and it was a lot less then 150 years ago.
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MEEK AND MILD
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BuckFan
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Apr 12 2016, 11:37 PM
Post #22
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- estonianman
- Apr 12 2016, 11:31 PM
- BuckFan
- Apr 12 2016, 11:20 PM
- estonianman
- Apr 12 2016, 06:56 PM
So we compare costs 150 years ago and conclude that prices have gone up. Who wudda guessed? So the solution is to go back to fraternal organizations providing health insurance ... got it.
Technology should increase productivity, and thereby decrease prices. No? We agree healthcare is obviously fecked now - it might provide some value to look at a time when it wasn't fecked, and it was a lot less then 150 years ago. And it does, technology applied to certain surgeries like hip and knee replacements have reduced the cost significantly.
But technology can also be expensive. Imaging technology has become amazing but the costs of these new imaging machines is orders of magnitude greater than the lowly X-ray machine.
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estonianman
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Apr 12 2016, 11:41 PM
Post #23
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- BuckFan
- Apr 12 2016, 11:37 PM
- estonianman
- Apr 12 2016, 11:31 PM
- BuckFan
- Apr 12 2016, 11:20 PM
Technology should increase productivity, and thereby decrease prices. No? We agree healthcare is obviously fecked now - it might provide some value to look at a time when it wasn't fecked, and it was a lot less then 150 years ago.
And it does, technology applied to certain surgeries like hip and knee replacements have reduced the cost significantly. But technology can also be expensive. Imaging technology has become amazing but the costs of these new imaging machines is orders of magnitude greater than the lowly X-ray machine. I realize this is anecdotal but I literally saw an entire warehouse of used MRI machines sitting, unused waiting for export in LA a couple years ago.
wtf?
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MEEK AND MILD
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Right-Wing
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Apr 13 2016, 12:05 AM
Post #24
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- estonianman
- Apr 12 2016, 11:41 PM
- BuckFan
- Apr 12 2016, 11:37 PM
- estonianman
- Apr 12 2016, 11:31 PM
And it does, technology applied to certain surgeries like hip and knee replacements have reduced the cost significantly. But technology can also be expensive. Imaging technology has become amazing but the costs of these new imaging machines is orders of magnitude greater than the lowly X-ray machine.
I realize this is anecdotal but I literally saw an entire warehouse of used MRI machines sitting, unused waiting for export in LA a couple years ago. wtf? Cheap Imaging
Company info:
We were created in 2000 in order to help people without insurance find affordable MRIs and CT Scans in Southern California. Since then, we have grown significantly and now offer discounted prices on imaging
State MRI Prices CT Scan Prices
Alabama Starting at $380 Starting at $270 Alaska Contact us for quote Contact us for quote Arizona Starting at $290 Starting at $190 Arkansas Starting at $510 Starting at $250 California Starting at $235 Starting at $200 Colorado Starting at $550 Starting at $350 Etc. Etc.
http://cheapimaging.com/
Amazing how much less MRI's and CT scans cost when people are paying out of pocket...
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Donald Trump is Barack Obama's President!
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Robert Stout
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Apr 13 2016, 12:05 AM
Post #25
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- BuckFan
- Apr 12 2016, 11:22 PM
- clone
- Apr 12 2016, 07:43 PM
- BuckFan
- Apr 12 2016, 01:56 PM
Quoting limited to 3 levels deep
Get the nanny out of healthcare and HSA's come way down....there was another thread where someone was saying the price of an end of life drug went up significantly so the endoflifers went out and created their own for under $500....significantly cheaper...capitalism by socialists at work...got to love it
How can HSA's come way down? HSA are savings accounts, a dollar in and a dollar out. Will a HSA cover a $500,000 liver transplant ????......................
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Jesus can raise the dead, but he can't fix stupid
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Robert Stout
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Apr 13 2016, 12:09 AM
Post #26
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- Right-Wing
- Apr 13 2016, 12:05 AM
- estonianman
- Apr 12 2016, 11:41 PM
- BuckFan
- Apr 12 2016, 11:37 PM
I realize this is anecdotal but I literally saw an entire warehouse of used MRI machines sitting, unused waiting for export in LA a couple years ago. wtf?
Cheap Imaging Company info: We were created in 2000 in order to help people without insurance find affordable MRIs and CT Scans in Southern California. Since then, we have grown significantly and now offer discounted prices on imaging State MRI Prices CT Scan Prices Alabama Starting at $380 Starting at $270 Alaska Contact us for quote Contact us for quote Arizona Starting at $290 Starting at $190 Arkansas Starting at $510 Starting at $250 California Starting at $235 Starting at $200 Colorado Starting at $550 Starting at $350 Etc. Etc. http://cheapimaging.com/Amazing how much less MRI's and CT scans cost when people are paying out of pocket... Duh....They are charging the discount price that Medicare and health insurance companies pay.............
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Jesus can raise the dead, but he can't fix stupid
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Right-Wing
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Apr 13 2016, 12:09 AM
Post #27
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Oklahoma City hospital posts surgery prices online; creates bidding war
OKLAHOMA CITY - An Oklahoma City surgery center is offering a new kind of price transparency, posting guaranteed all-inclusive surgery prices online. The move is revolutionizing medical billing in Oklahoma and around the world. http://kfor.com/2013/07/08/okc-hospital-posting-surgery-prices-online/
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Donald Trump is Barack Obama's President!
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Robert Stout
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Apr 13 2016, 12:11 AM
Post #28
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- Right-Wing
- Apr 13 2016, 12:09 AM
Oklahoma City hospital posts surgery prices online; creates bidding war OKLAHOMA CITY - An Oklahoma City surgery center is offering a new kind of price transparency, posting guaranteed all-inclusive surgery prices online. The move is revolutionizing medical billing in Oklahoma and around the world. http://kfor.com/2013/07/08/okc-hospital-posting-surgery-prices-online/ You can get surgery for much less in Tijuana..............
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Jesus can raise the dead, but he can't fix stupid
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estonianman
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Apr 13 2016, 12:16 AM
Post #29
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- Robert Stout
- Apr 13 2016, 12:11 AM
- Right-Wing
- Apr 13 2016, 12:09 AM
Oklahoma City hospital posts surgery prices online; creates bidding war OKLAHOMA CITY - An Oklahoma City surgery center is offering a new kind of price transparency, posting guaranteed all-inclusive surgery prices online. The move is revolutionizing medical billing in Oklahoma and around the world. http://kfor.com/2013/07/08/okc-hospital-posting-surgery-prices-online/
You can get surgery for much less in Tijuana.............. Mexicali.
and stop at "meow meow" on the way back - its worth it.
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MEEK AND MILD
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clone
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Apr 13 2016, 10:51 AM
Post #30
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Director @ Center for Advanced Memetic Warfare
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- Robert Stout
- Apr 13 2016, 12:11 AM
- Right-Wing
- Apr 13 2016, 12:09 AM
Oklahoma City hospital posts surgery prices online; creates bidding war OKLAHOMA CITY - An Oklahoma City surgery center is offering a new kind of price transparency, posting guaranteed all-inclusive surgery prices online. The move is revolutionizing medical billing in Oklahoma and around the world. http://kfor.com/2013/07/08/okc-hospital-posting-surgery-prices-online/
You can get surgery for much less in Tijuana.............. No nanny needed....
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Only liberals can choose not to go down the road to widespread, systematic violence.
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BuckFan
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Apr 13 2016, 02:15 PM
Post #31
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- estonianman
- Apr 12 2016, 11:41 PM
- BuckFan
- Apr 12 2016, 11:37 PM
- estonianman
- Apr 12 2016, 11:31 PM
And it does, technology applied to certain surgeries like hip and knee replacements have reduced the cost significantly. But technology can also be expensive. Imaging technology has become amazing but the costs of these new imaging machines is orders of magnitude greater than the lowly X-ray machine.
I realize this is anecdotal but I literally saw an entire warehouse of used MRI machines sitting, unused waiting for export in LA a couple years ago. wtf? I would suspect we are exporting old technology MRI machines to countries that don't have them and upgrading with new. MRI technology is growing leaps and bounds and obsolescence is almost as bad as cell phones. All that great technology comes with a cost.
On another note, years ago on this site (the old one) I had a thread going on an article that followed the money on why health care is so expensive. This reporter ended up in Arizona or Texas or someplace in the Southwest and found it wasn't immigrants or uninsured or any of the most common villains. It was doctors owning a piece of the diagnostics business. He found that doctors that had a financial interest in the MRI facility or X-ray facility or whatever would order tests and images at a much higher rate. Basically feeding their own business.
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estonianman
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Apr 16 2016, 12:13 PM
Post #32
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- BuckFan
- Apr 13 2016, 02:15 PM
- estonianman
- Apr 12 2016, 11:41 PM
- BuckFan
- Apr 12 2016, 11:37 PM
I realize this is anecdotal but I literally saw an entire warehouse of used MRI machines sitting, unused waiting for export in LA a couple years ago. wtf?
I would suspect we are exporting old technology MRI machines to countries that don't have them and upgrading with new. MRI technology is growing leaps and bounds and obsolescence is almost as bad as cell phones. All that great technology comes with a cost. On another note, years ago on this site (the old one) I had a thread going on an article that followed the money on why health care is so expensive. This reporter ended up in Arizona or Texas or someplace in the Southwest and found it wasn't immigrants or uninsured or any of the most common villains. It was doctors owning a piece of the diagnostics business. He found that doctors that had a financial interest in the MRI facility or X-ray facility or whatever would order tests and images at a much higher rate. Basically feeding their own business. There was about 100+ MRIs, i'm not joking - but the techs at this warehouse were. IF healthcare supply is such an issue in the US these companies could generate some nice revenue with these machines - instead they are forced to give them to North Korea?
On a another note - I just read this definition of single payer on another forum:
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Single Buyer – Everyone needs to buy insurance themselves. No more subsidized insurance from your company. Companies can pay more, or give that extra in another form of bonus but people need to shop around and find what works for them at what price. I currently have two choices, what my employer offers or a cobra equivalent with ridiculous pricing.
Nothing mentioned about the government negotiating price.
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MEEK AND MILD
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BuckFan
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Apr 16 2016, 12:47 PM
Post #33
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- estonianman
- Apr 16 2016, 12:13 PM
- BuckFan
- Apr 13 2016, 02:15 PM
- estonianman
- Apr 12 2016, 11:41 PM
I would suspect we are exporting old technology MRI machines to countries that don't have them and upgrading with new. MRI technology is growing leaps and bounds and obsolescence is almost as bad as cell phones. All that great technology comes with a cost. On another note, years ago on this site (the old one) I had a thread going on an article that followed the money on why health care is so expensive. This reporter ended up in Arizona or Texas or someplace in the Southwest and found it wasn't immigrants or uninsured or any of the most common villains. It was doctors owning a piece of the diagnostics business. He found that doctors that had a financial interest in the MRI facility or X-ray facility or whatever would order tests and images at a much higher rate. Basically feeding their own business.
There was about 100+ MRIs, i'm not joking - but the techs at this warehouse were. IF healthcare supply is such an issue in the US these companies could generate some nice revenue with these machines - instead they are forced to give them to North Korea? On a another note - I just read this definition of single payer on another forum: - Quote:
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Single Buyer – Everyone needs to buy insurance themselves. No more subsidized insurance from your company. Companies can pay more, or give that extra in another form of bonus but people need to shop around and find what works for them at what price. I currently have two choices, what my employer offers or a cobra equivalent with ridiculous pricing.
Nothing mentioned about the government negotiating price. Two different things.
Single Payer, which was the OP topic, is where all health care costs are covered by one entity. Typically it is assumed that is the government with a Medicaid/Medicare for all type system.
Single Buyer is a different variation on the current system of health insurance companies. Instead of group coverage under the umbrella of an employer, everyone buys their own insurance through an exchange like under ACA. Employers get out from under the cost of managing health insurance benefits but hopefully they pass the premium savings on to the employee to help pay their premiums.
The big issue here is that the cost of benefits is weighing down U.S. companies and making them noncompetitive. The idea is to get employers out of the insurance business and let individuals take care of it like they do home and auto insurance.
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estonianman
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Apr 16 2016, 01:09 PM
Post #34
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- BuckFan
- Apr 16 2016, 12:47 PM
- estonianman
- Apr 16 2016, 12:13 PM
- BuckFan
- Apr 13 2016, 02:15 PM
There was about 100+ MRIs, i'm not joking - but the techs at this warehouse were. IF healthcare supply is such an issue in the US these companies could generate some nice revenue with these machines - instead they are forced to give them to North Korea? On a another note - I just read this definition of single payer on another forum: - Quote:
-
Single Buyer – Everyone needs to buy insurance themselves. No more subsidized insurance from your company. Companies can pay more, or give that extra in another form of bonus but people need to shop around and find what works for them at what price. I currently have two choices, what my employer offers or a cobra equivalent with ridiculous pricing.
Nothing mentioned about the government negotiating price.
Two different things. Single Payer, which was the OP topic, is where all health care costs are covered by one entity. Typically it is assumed that is the government with a Medicaid/Medicare for all type system. Single Buyer is a different variation on the current system of health insurance companies. Instead of group coverage under the umbrella of an employer, everyone buys their own insurance through an exchange like under ACA. Employers get out from under the cost of managing health insurance benefits but hopefully they pass the premium savings on to the employee to help pay their premiums. The big issue here is that the cost of benefits is weighing down U.S. companies and making them noncompetitive. The idea is to get employers out of the insurance business and let individuals take care of it like they do home and auto insurance. and this is ideal. Except for the amount of electable procedures that are mandated to be covered under health insurance - like maternity care.
These would have to be converted to "over the counter" expenses that could be pre-negotiated or package deals offered by insurance companies. Still - there is no reason that someone suffering from illness should be forced to cover someone else's birth control.
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MEEK AND MILD
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