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Donald Trump Could Threaten U.S. Rule of Law, Scholars Say
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Topic Started: Jun 5 2016, 07:31 AM (902 Views)
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estonianman
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Jun 11 2016, 10:59 PM
Post #21
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- Two a.m.
- Jun 11 2016, 10:44 PM
- CautionaryTales
- Jun 11 2016, 08:21 PM
- The_Edgitarian
- Jun 11 2016, 08:15 PM
Quoting limited to 3 levels deep
Is that all you got son? You want to be "scary"?
Oddly, the Edgitarian/Identitarian appears at least to know what he is voting for. By contrast, there are a great many supporting Trump who have deluded themselves into believing he is something very different than he is. Conservatives like Paul Ryan believe he can be housebroken like a misbehaving puppy and become a conservative. Many conservatives in fact believe he is conservative. Meanwhile, Hillary haters on the left like Eddo and Gizmo have even said at times that they believe him to be liberal. Various anti-establishment voters are grabbing onto him as a force for "change," a nebulous concept they can't or won't define. Many just see him in terms of being a non-Clinton. But the truth is that Edgitarian/Identitarian appears to understand what he is better than most. He is a fascist. He is irrational. He is obsessed with uber-masculinity. He believes in power over process and rule by personality over rule of law. He is authoritarian in style. He is anti-immigrant, anti-Muslim, jingoistic and virulently nationalistic. He believes in personality over policy and really has few coherent policies at all. He doesn't need them. He is strongly related in outlook to the alt. right movement and a long, discarded anti-enlightment view of life revolving around power and strongman government. He is basically everything the 20th Century correctly taught us to fear. Edgitarian/Identitarian knows what Trump is and wants these things. Thus his actions, while abhorrent, are logical. His references to fear are also logical. At the end of the day, the country will be divided into three camps over Trump: the fooled, the fascists and the fearful. The fascists are true Trump supporters. They believe in order, nation, language, borders and Western Culture (or at least the highly non-liberal anti-enlightenment parts of it) They know what they are voting for and it isn't a set of policies. It is a very scary and very dangerous philosophy. The fearful are going to be pretty much all of us behind Hillary. Some of us like her. Some of us despise her. Many will be liberal or moderate. Some will be conservative. But all of us understand what Trump is and why he cannot be allowed near power. This election won't be about Hillary. It will be about fascism or non-fascism. The fooled are everyone else. The undecided voters, the conservatives who fall in line because Trump has an "R" behind his name, the goofy "change" voters, the burnt-out Bernie types and others anti-Clintonites who either stay home, vote third party or actively support Trump, the false equivalency types who think Hillary and Donald are equally problematic or morally interchangeable. Basically, it includes anyone who doesn't see this election as a mortal threat to the republic and who believes that backing Trump, disconnecting themselves or straddling the line is a viable alternative. The definition of fascism is the collusion of government with the private sector.
By that definition - Clinton is far more fascistic then Trump is.
Trump is a nationalist - a reaction to globalism going to far. The very same drive to get Brexit passed is what is getting Trump so much attention.
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MEEK AND MILD
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Two a.m.
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Jun 11 2016, 11:17 PM
Post #22
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- estonianman
- Jun 11 2016, 10:59 PM
- Two a.m.
- Jun 11 2016, 10:44 PM
- CautionaryTales
- Jun 11 2016, 08:21 PM
Quoting limited to 3 levels deep
Oddly, the Edgitarian/Identitarian appears at least to know what he is voting for. By contrast, there are a great many supporting Trump who have deluded themselves into believing he is something very different than he is. Conservatives like Paul Ryan believe he can be housebroken like a misbehaving puppy and become a conservative. Many conservatives in fact believe he is conservative. Meanwhile, Hillary haters on the left like Eddo and Gizmo have even said at times that they believe him to be liberal. Various anti-establishment voters are grabbing onto him as a force for "change," a nebulous concept they can't or won't define. Many just see him in terms of being a non-Clinton. But the truth is that Edgitarian/Identitarian appears to understand what he is better than most. He is a fascist. He is irrational. He is obsessed with uber-masculinity. He believes in power over process and rule by personality over rule of law. He is authoritarian in style. He is anti-immigrant, anti-Muslim, jingoistic and virulently nationalistic. He believes in personality over policy and really has few coherent policies at all. He doesn't need them. He is strongly related in outlook to the alt. right movement and a long, discarded anti-enlightment view of life revolving around power and strongman government. He is basically everything the 20th Century correctly taught us to fear. Edgitarian/Identitarian knows what Trump is and wants these things. Thus his actions, while abhorrent, are logical. His references to fear are also logical. At the end of the day, the country will be divided into three camps over Trump: the fooled, the fascists and the fearful. The fascists are true Trump supporters. They believe in order, nation, language, borders and Western Culture (or at least the highly non-liberal anti-enlightenment parts of it) They know what they are voting for and it isn't a set of policies. It is a very scary and very dangerous philosophy. The fearful are going to be pretty much all of us behind Hillary. Some of us like her. Some of us despise her. Many will be liberal or moderate. Some will be conservative. But all of us understand what Trump is and why he cannot be allowed near power. This election won't be about Hillary. It will be about fascism or non-fascism. The fooled are everyone else. The undecided voters, the conservatives who fall in line because Trump has an "R" behind his name, the goofy "change" voters, the burnt-out Bernie types and others anti-Clintonites who either stay home, vote third party or actively support Trump, the false equivalency types who think Hillary and Donald are equally problematic or morally interchangeable. Basically, it includes anyone who doesn't see this election as a mortal threat to the republic and who believes that backing Trump, disconnecting themselves or straddling the line is a viable alternative.
The definition of fascism is the collusion of government with the private sector. By that definition - Clinton is far more fascistic then Trump is. Trump is a nationalist - a reaction to globalism going to far. The very same drive to get Brexit passed is what is getting Trump so much attention. Private sector collusion with government is one part of fascism but not its defining characteristic.
Defining characteristics of fascism (in my book anyway) would include authoritarianism, uber-masculinity, ardent nationalism, a strong focus on borders, immigration/definition of national culture, militarism and rejection of rule of law as a concept. Plus, a big focus on personality rather than issues or ideas.
Many candidates have some aspects of these characteristics - including Hillary. But Trump is very strongly defined by most of them. By contrast, Hillary is pretty much a normal candidate.
Also a word about collusion between government and the private sector. This is often brought up as an aspect of fascism - particularly by liberals who tend to see fascism in virtually any campaign contribution from Corporate America.
But they actually have it backwards. In fascism, corporations don't exert influence on politicians (e.g. Goldman-Sachs bribing Hillary Clinton with a speaking fee). Instead, it is politicians who exert influence on the corporations. Corporations cooperate with government under fascism but corporate power is the JUNIOR partner in the arrangement. Government calls the shots. Corporate titans profited from Nazi Germany's largesse but none of them ever walked into Hitler's office, propped their expensive loafers up on the desk and gave the Fuhrer marching orders about what laws to pass. Hillary Clinton-style influence peddling only works because we're a democracy. Try a move like that under fascism and it doesn't matter how much money you have. You end up in a labor camp or in an unmarked grave with a bullet to the forehead.
If Hillary Clinton were a fascist we wouldn't worry about whether she was controlled by the big banks. We'd worry about whether she'd be controlling them.
Edited by Two a.m., Jun 11 2016, 11:19 PM.
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"The stars can be near or distant, according as we need them." - George Orwell, 1984
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estonianman
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Jun 11 2016, 11:20 PM
Post #23
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- Two a.m.
- Jun 11 2016, 11:17 PM
- estonianman
- Jun 11 2016, 10:59 PM
- Two a.m.
- Jun 11 2016, 10:44 PM
Quoting limited to 3 levels deep
The definition of fascism is the collusion of government with the private sector. By that definition - Clinton is far more fascistic then Trump is. Trump is a nationalist - a reaction to globalism going to far. The very same drive to get Brexit passed is what is getting Trump so much attention.
Private sector collusion with government is one part of fascism but not its defining characteristic. Defining characteristics of fascism (in my book anyway) would include authoritarianism, uber-masculinity, ardent nationalism, a strong focus on borders, immigration/definition of national culture, militarism and rejection of rule of law as a concept. Plus, a big focus on personality rather than issues or ideas. Many candidates have some aspects of these characteristics - including Hillary. But Trump is very strongly defined by most of them. By contrast, Hillary is pretty much a normal candidate. Also a word about collusion between government and the private sector. This is often brought up as an aspect of fascism - particularly by liberals who tend to see fascism in virtually any campaign contribution from Corporate America. But they actually have it backwards. In fascism, corporations don't exert influence on politicians (e.g. Goldman-Sachs bribing Hillary Clinton with a speaking fee). Instead, it is politicians who exert influence on the corporations. Corporations cooperate with government under fascism but corporate power is the JUNIOR partner in the arrangement. Government calls the shots. Corporate titans profited from Nazi Germany's largesse but none of them ever walked into Hitler's office, propped their expensive loafers up on the desk and gave the Fuhrer marching orders about what laws to pass. Hillary Clinton-style influence peddling only works because we're a democracy. Try a move like that under fascism and it doesn't matter how much money you have. You end up in a labor camp or in an unmarked grave with a bullet to the forehead. If Hillary Clinton were a fascist we wouldn't worry about whether she was controlled by the big banks. We'd worry about whether she'd be controlling them. Well said - I agree with this.
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MEEK AND MILD
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Harambe4Trump
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Jun 11 2016, 11:22 PM
Post #24
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- Two a.m.
- Jun 11 2016, 10:44 PM
- CautionaryTales
- Jun 11 2016, 08:21 PM
- The_Edgitarian
- Jun 11 2016, 08:15 PM
Quoting limited to 3 levels deep
Is that all you got son? You want to be "scary"?
Oddly, the Edgitarian/Identitarian appears at least to know what he is voting for. By contrast, there are a great many supporting Trump who have deluded themselves into believing he is something very different than he is. Conservatives like Paul Ryan believe he can be housebroken like a misbehaving puppy and become a conservative. Many conservatives in fact believe he is conservative. Meanwhile, Hillary haters on the left like Eddo and Gizmo have even said at times that they believe him to be liberal. Various anti-establishment voters are grabbing onto him as a force for "change," a nebulous concept they can't or won't define. Many just see him in terms of being a non-Clinton. But the truth is that Edgitarian/Identitarian appears to understand what he is better than most. He is a fascist. He is irrational. He is obsessed with uber-masculinity. He believes in power over process and rule by personality over rule of law. He is authoritarian in style. He is anti-immigrant, anti-Muslim, jingoistic and virulently nationalistic. He believes in personality over policy and really has few coherent policies at all. He doesn't need them. He is strongly related in outlook to the alt. right movement and a long, discarded anti-enlightment view of life revolving around power and strongman government. He is basically everything the 20th Century correctly taught us to fear. Edgitarian/Identitarian knows what Trump is and wants these things. Thus his actions, while abhorrent, are logical. His references to fear are also logical. At the end of the day, the country will be divided into three camps over Trump: the fooled, the fascists and the fearful. The fascists are true Trump supporters. They believe in order, nation, language, borders and Western Culture (or at least the highly non-liberal anti-enlightenment parts of it) They know what they are voting for and it isn't a set of policies. It is a very scary and very dangerous philosophy. The fearful are going to be pretty much all of us behind Hillary. Some of us like her. Some of us despise her. Many will be liberal or moderate. Some will be conservative. But all of us understand what Trump is and why he cannot be allowed near power. This election won't be about Hillary. It will be about fascism or non-fascism. The fooled are everyone else. The undecided voters, the conservatives who fall in line because Trump has an "R" behind his name, the goofy "change" voters, the burnt-out Bernie types and others anti-Clintonites who either stay home, vote third party or actively support Trump, the false equivalency types who think Hillary and Donald are equally problematic or morally interchangeable. Basically, it includes anyone who doesn't see this election as a mortal threat to the republic and who believes that backing Trump, disconnecting themselves or straddling the line is a viable alternative. Fear is all Hillary has to offer. Fear of not sending your son . . . Er daughter to die in some far off land in some pointless war, fear that multinational corporations won't be able drive American wages to parity with South America, and fear that this nation won't become as crowded and filthy as India.
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Skipping leg day is the equivalent of a woman having an abortion. You're ashamed of it, and it was probably unnecessary. #MAGA #wallsnotwars
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Harambe4Trump
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Jun 11 2016, 11:23 PM
Post #25
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- estonianman
- Jun 11 2016, 11:20 PM
- Two a.m.
- Jun 11 2016, 11:17 PM
- estonianman
- Jun 11 2016, 10:59 PM
Quoting limited to 3 levels deep
Private sector collusion with government is one part of fascism but not its defining characteristic. Defining characteristics of fascism (in my book anyway) would include authoritarianism, uber-masculinity, ardent nationalism, a strong focus on borders, immigration/definition of national culture, militarism and rejection of rule of law as a concept. Plus, a big focus on personality rather than issues or ideas. Many candidates have some aspects of these characteristics - including Hillary. But Trump is very strongly defined by most of them. By contrast, Hillary is pretty much a normal candidate. Also a word about collusion between government and the private sector. This is often brought up as an aspect of fascism - particularly by liberals who tend to see fascism in virtually any campaign contribution from Corporate America. But they actually have it backwards. In fascism, corporations don't exert influence on politicians (e.g. Goldman-Sachs bribing Hillary Clinton with a speaking fee). Instead, it is politicians who exert influence on the corporations. Corporations cooperate with government under fascism but corporate power is the JUNIOR partner in the arrangement. Government calls the shots. Corporate titans profited from Nazi Germany's largesse but none of them ever walked into Hitler's office, propped their expensive loafers up on the desk and gave the Fuhrer marching orders about what laws to pass. Hillary Clinton-style influence peddling only works because we're a democracy. Try a move like that under fascism and it doesn't matter how much money you have. You end up in a labor camp or in an unmarked grave with a bullet to the forehead. If Hillary Clinton were a fascist we wouldn't worry about whether she was controlled by the big banks. We'd worry about whether she'd be controlling them.
Well said - I agree with this. Hillary Clinton is not a fascist; she will not get Amtrak to run on time.
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Skipping leg day is the equivalent of a woman having an abortion. You're ashamed of it, and it was probably unnecessary. #MAGA #wallsnotwars
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Harambe4Trump
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Jun 11 2016, 11:35 PM
Post #26
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- Two a.m.
- Jun 11 2016, 10:46 PM
- Tsalagi
- Jun 11 2016, 10:26 PM
- Two a.m.
- Jun 11 2016, 08:17 PM
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Don't worry for it 2am, you're white and middle class....you'll be safe in the Trump regime, it's only the brown people south of the border, and the brown people saying Allah Ackbar who have anything to fear from him.
No, I'm afraid not. I'm a free thinker. People like me get put in the camps even before the brown people do. Oh please, you people are melodramatic. Cut some financing for pointless gender studies programs and base employment practices on best candidate for the job and not on ethnicity and you people will lose your mind.
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Skipping leg day is the equivalent of a woman having an abortion. You're ashamed of it, and it was probably unnecessary. #MAGA #wallsnotwars
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estonianman
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Jun 12 2016, 12:19 AM
Post #27
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- The_Edgitarian
- Jun 11 2016, 11:23 PM
- estonianman
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- Two a.m.
- Jun 11 2016, 11:17 PM
Quoting limited to 3 levels deep
Well said - I agree with this.
Hillary Clinton is not a fascist; she will not get Amtrak to run on time. Anyone that advocates for federal regulatory system is fascist.
Just because you are a fascist - doesn't mean that you are successful.
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MEEK AND MILD
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estonianman
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Jun 12 2016, 01:59 AM
Post #28
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- voted4reagan
- Jun 11 2016, 09:26 PM
Both Hillary and Trump are morons...
Can we make a Kaisich/Bernie hybrid and have it run as an independent?
pffffffffffffft
Kaisich is a gigantic pussy.
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MEEK AND MILD
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Alt Right PEPE
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Jun 12 2016, 09:27 AM
Post #29
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Yes, Trump could threaten U S Law by actually enforcing existing laws already on the books (see immigration laws).
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"Be polite, be friendly. But have a plan to kill everyone you meet." Gen Mattis
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CautionaryTales
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Jun 12 2016, 09:39 AM
Post #30
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- Tsalagi
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- Two a.m.
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Of course. No rational thinking person should be otherwise.
Don't worry for it 2am, you're white and middle class....you'll be safe in the Trump regime, it's only the brown people south of the border, and the brown people saying Allah Ackbar who have anything to fear from him. And anyone that could pass as brown in the eyes of the blonde haired blue eyed Trumparazzi.
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Have you paid your internet taxes?
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Robert Stout
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Jun 12 2016, 11:29 AM
Post #31
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- CautionaryTales
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- Two a.m.
- Jun 11 2016, 08:17 PM
Quoting limited to 3 levels deep
Don't worry for it 2am, you're white and middle class....you'll be safe in the Trump regime, it's only the brown people south of the border, and the brown people saying Allah Ackbar who have anything to fear from him.
And anyone that could pass as brown in the eyes of the blonde haired blue eyed Trumparazzi. You are jealous of Trump's hair....Admit it..............
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Jesus can raise the dead, but he can't fix stupid
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Tsalagi
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Jun 12 2016, 11:48 AM
Post #32
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- Two a.m.
- Jun 11 2016, 10:46 PM
- Tsalagi
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- Two a.m.
- Jun 11 2016, 08:17 PM
Quoting limited to 3 levels deep
Don't worry for it 2am, you're white and middle class....you'll be safe in the Trump regime, it's only the brown people south of the border, and the brown people saying Allah Ackbar who have anything to fear from him.
No, I'm afraid not. I'm a free thinker. People like me get put in the camps even before the brown people do. Well...if it came down to it...I can probably get you a piece of land back on the reservation, we'll sneak your name in on the rolls.
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